(03-02-2013, 04:44 PM)AbiDrew85 Wrote: Maybe not necessarily. Maybe just soy is a big no no.
Soy phyto's are honestly some of the weakest of the lot and it COULD be that you're so low on your own natural estrogens that the soy completely replaced it. And no one has EVER had significant breast size while consuming large quantities of soy. It androgynizes. It makes men more girly and girls less.
Let's see what the results say. When do you expect them?
Wow, so soy products can potentially have the opposite effect on girls? I've always thought that including some soy products in your diet was a plus for NBE because of the phytoestrogens. I didn't think it'd lead to a drastic increase in bust size or anything, but I certainly didn't think it would do the reverse in some cases...
(03-02-2013, 06:09 PM)Ever Hopeful Wrote: Wow, so soy products can potentially have the opposite effect on girls? I've always thought that including some soy products in your diet was a plus for NBE because of the phytoestrogens. I didn't think it'd lead to a drastic increase in bust size or anything, but I certainly didn't think it would do the reverse in some cases...
Yeah. Don't feel bad. A lot of people seem to share that misconception. Soy is actually generally something both genders really ought to avoid insofar as physical appearance goes... Then again, when it comes to health... Soy is amazing. It's like, one of natures cruelest jokes.
Shipping from Australia to the US takes a while, so I'm looking at around a month at least before I get it back (although sometimes miracles do happen and things get through quickly). I only got E2 and Progesterone tested, although now I'm thinking that may be a mistake, and I might as well have tested everything at once, although I have never had any symptoms of excess androgens.
I've always kind of thought I was estrogen dominant, since I had many of the symptoms of estrogen dominance throughout my teens and prior to going on birth control. Nowadays though, I don't really get any of those symptoms. I actually have reduced libido and vaginal dryness (TMI I know) now as side effects of the birth control! (related to low estrogen or low testosterone? I'm not sure) I'm really quite curious now how it will come back. I think there is a huge chance now that it will come back completely normal.
(This post was last modified: 04-02-2013, 03:54 PM by AbiDrew85.)
Estrogen is actually hugely important to female libido. I had no real libido when I had a testosterone-driven system. But when I started cutting my T down and adding estrogens, I actually started to develop a bit of a one. Now I have a raging libido at times.
You may have been E dominant in the past but I have a sneaking suspicion you'll come back deficient. You might come back deficient in both.
EDIT:
It is a shame you didn't get a full panel done, but E2 and P should give enough of an idea, hopefully. It usually does.
I used to have tons of the top ones prior to going on the BCP, both the ** ones and others. But now I have some ** ones and a few non-** from both top and bottom, so it may well be a case of low estrogen and low progesterone.
What I have to wonder is how combination birth control could have caused that change (if it did, and it's not some random occurance). I mean, sure combination birth control inhibits GnRH release (and therefore FSH and LH release; and therefore estradiol and progesterone release from the ovaries), but wouldn't the ethinyl estradiol "make up" for the drop in natural estrogen? I don't see how it would cause symptoms of low estrogen (if it makes estrogen levels high enough to inhibit GnRH release). The only thing I can think of is that maybe the drops in estrogen are not as significant, but the amount of estrogen overall is lower? I'm really not sure... all this hormone business is a bit confusing!
More research to do! Dunno if I can find anything on it! lol
It sounds like a good idea to get the saliva test done! I think the results are very informative and they can certainly help guide you in how you should proceed in the NBE process.
I wish the tests were a bit more affordable for me at the moment. ^^; I'm seeing rates anywhere from $170 to $250... Is there any chance that health insurance covers this cost? LOL.
(15-02-2013, 04:24 PM)Ever Hopeful Wrote: It sounds like a good idea to get the saliva test done! I think the results are very informative and they can certainly help guide you in how you should proceed in the NBE process.
I wish the tests were a bit more affordable for me at the moment. ^^; I'm seeing rates anywhere from $170 to $250... Is there any chance that health insurance covers this cost? LOL.
Maybe if you actually go and get a prescription. I think most doctors will prescribe a blood test, rather than a saliva test, but I remember seeing a place to bill an insurance provider on the form that goes along with the test I recieved. However, they would only bill certain providers (and it was a short list!).
It's worth a shot to see if you can get one covered by insurance. If you think you have a hormonal imbalance or have a history of PCOS/other conditions that affect your hormones, they may very well do one.
Sounds to me like you should go for a combination of suppressing some T but not too much (maybe 1 packet of mint tea a day?), and raising E and P pretty much evenly. The main problem is that even though you're in range, you're low in range. On both.
So, my suggestions would be: PM, try maybe 500mg for two weeks of your cycle only, immediately following the end of your period. PC: try maybe what I'm doing, but maybe cap it to only 1/4th tsp instead of the half I take at my peak dose. And a mint medley tea, one packet/mug a day.
See how that treats you.
Though I don't really know how any of that will interact with your combination BC pill. It could raise your risks of getting pregnant despite the BC possibly.
(This post was last modified: 16-02-2013, 05:37 AM by prismatic.)
(16-02-2013, 01:25 AM)AbiDrew85 Wrote: Sounds to me like you should go for a combination of suppressing some T but not too much (maybe 1 packet of mint tea a day?), and raising E and P pretty much evenly. The main problem is that even though you're in range, you're low in range. On both.
So, my suggestions would be: PM, try maybe 500mg for two weeks of your cycle only, immediately following the end of your period. PC: try maybe what I'm doing, but maybe cap it to only 1/4th tsp instead of the half I take at my peak dose. And a mint medley tea, one packet/mug a day.
See how that treats you.
Though I don't really know how any of that will interact with your combination BC pill. It could raise your risks of getting pregnant despite the BC possibly.
Other opinions? Your own thoughts?
I was thinking almost the same thing! I've been researching the best anti-androgen to take. I don't want one that's too strong (or with too many weaker phytoestrogens), on account of my testosterone isn't *that* high, and it's giving me no symptoms. I didn't know mint was an anti-androgen. That might actually be the best option. Is it any different than a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor such as saw palmetto?
And thinking of trying PM as well, although I've heard mixed things on the effectiveness of PM with birth control. So I could either give it a go, go off of my birth control and see if my estrogen levels increase on their own, or switch to a different brand of BCP with a higher dose of hormones. I'm reluctant to go off the birth control, both because it's a convenient contraceptive, and lest my horrible pms return.
And I'd have to take it with BO (if indeed it does raise progesterone), as PC is not available in Australia without a prescription. Boo! Unless I can somehow sneak it in, but I don't like breaking laws. Too bad there aren't more herbs which increase progesterone.
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I think the results are very informative and they can certainly help guide you in how you should proceed in the NBE process.