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The Comprehensive NBE Program
#51
Hi Joe,

I am new to this forum and this is my very first post ever. I am in my early thirties and have always had a flat chest (34AA) and heavy bottom. I naturally tend to put on all the weight on my bum and sides of thighs but none on my breasts. That is the last place fat gets deposited in when I really gain a lot of weight. I eat a healthy diet and being underweight is not an issue here. I guess it could be hormonal imbalance with lack of progesterone and estrogen dominance. I am also prone to acne and facial hair and have had a history of irregular cycles. The cycles have been normal lately since I improved my nutrition and added regular exercise including strength training to my lifestyle.

What NBE program would you suggest me to start with? I tried using a herbal cream with phytoestrogens last year for about 2 months with no results. And I have not used anything else ever.

I was also particularly drawn to your recipes but not sure which one would be best for me as I am a newbie with very small cup size. Can you please suggest.

Ideally I would like to start with a safe program that is likely to show results in about 3 months (looking for quicker results I know). And last thing I want is to put on more weight on my hips and thighs by using the wrong program.

Everything I have read so far in your post made a lot of sense and I am really looking forward to your valuable guidance.

Thanks
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#52
Good nutrition is always the safest and most reliable way to go, so you could start with this post: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.ph...#pid177070

Since you seem to be estrogen dominant you may want to omit the pueraria mirifica. A hormone test would confirm that you really are estrogen dominant. DHT testosterone leads to acne and facial hair, so 160-320 mg saw palmetto extract can help there. Mint tea can lower testosterone in general, 5g per cup and 2 cups according to the study done on women. More progesterone cream could help lower estrogen too, but it may raise testosterone so vitex alone may be the safer slower way. Or if your acne clears up you can risk a little progesterone cream after that and continue if those issues don't return. Also note that fish oil may raise testosterone and worsen acne slightly temporarily, but long term the fatty acids are good for acne and I'd stick it out. Flax oil can also help with different fatty acids and it may lower testosterone slightly, so it may be good to take both.

Fenugreek seeds might cause weight gain or weight loss, and short term might improve or worsen estrogen dominance. So early on you may want to limit it to be safe then gradually add it in later as you get more balanced. Lowering your testosterone may also go to your thighs a little, especially with estrogen dominance, but it seems like you need to lower your testosterone and I'd stick it out until your estrogen dominance gets better and then less goes to your thighs.

Until everything is fixed up I wouldn't use any phytoestrogens, especially not pueraria mirifica, then after you're more balanced you can gradually add in a little bit.
Straight male into nutrition and herbs.

A good NBE program: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=23076
IGF and NBE: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=27347
 Reply
#53
I read that you recommend taking fenugreek extract containing saponines. There are different types of saponines, I only found the information about diosgenin resulting in growth of mamary tissue, as well as increasing the sensitivity of the receptors etc. Is it only kind of saponine that we need? Also when I search for diosgenin I always find much more yams pills, then fenugreek since the concentration of diosgenin in yams is supposed to be higher, it is very common to find yams pills with 20% diosgenin. I read the concentration of diosgenin in fenugreek seeds is between 0,4-0,8 or something like that. I know that is why you said it is better to take the fenugreek extract than the pills with the powder from the seed.
When it says 50% saponine in fenugreek pills, does it mean different sorts of saponine or only diosgenin? 
How much should I take if it clearly says diosgenin, which it does on my wild yams pills? Also 1000mg Diosgenin?
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#54
(26-10-2016, 08:32 PM)rateset Wrote: I read that you recommend taking fenugreek extract containing saponines. There are different types of saponines, I only found the information about diosgenin resulting in growth of mamary tissue, as well as increasing the sensitivity of the receptors etc. Is it only kind of saponine that we need? Also when I search for diosgenin I always find much more yams pills, then fenugreek since the concentration of diosgenin in yams is supposed to be higher, it is very common to find yams pills with 20% diosgenin. I read the concentration of diosgenin in fenugreek seeds is between 0,4-0,8 or something like that. I know that is why you said it is better to take the fenugreek extract than the pills with the powder from the seed.
When it says 50% saponine in fenugreek pills, does it mean different sorts of saponine or only diosgenin? 
How much should I take if it clearly says diosgenin, which it does on my wild yams pills? Also 1000mg Diosgenin?


Sorry for the delay, I think I was super busy last time I saw this post and then forgot about it.  Other saponins besides diosgenin are helpful too.  Diosgenin just happens to be the most common saponin in fenugreek and wild yam.  The 20% diosgenin pills you are looking at are an extract; wild yam is typically 0.5 to 1.2% diosgenin:
http://www.livestrong.com/article/458952...h-control/ (the article says wild yam doesn't work as birth control btw, just ctrl+F the info on diosgenin)
Likewise you can find fenugreek extracts with up to 50% saponins.  As you can tell that is much stronger than the powder which IIRC is a little under 2% saponins (maybe 0.4-0.8% is diosgenin only?).  50% saponin fenugreek has various saponins which includes diosgenin but also others.  Since diosgenin is the most common saponin in both, you wouldn't be too far off to assume that the strength of diosgenin is similar to the strength of the saponins in general.  It would at least be in the right ballpark.  Beyond that I don't know precisely.
Straight male into nutrition and herbs.

A good NBE program: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=23076
IGF and NBE: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=27347
 Reply
#55
(22-11-2015, 05:23 PM)surferjoe2007 Wrote: Recipes
I have a couple recipes.  I was debating whether or not to start a new thread for this but I decided to put it here since it's related to this program.

This is a powder and cream combo that should be used together.  Links are only example sources for convenience; you may buy ingredients from almost anywhere.  Ingredients that must be topical or have a bad taste are in the cream.  Ingredients that would be too bulky or hard to absorb in a cream are kept in the powder.  So it is kept simple, small, relatively pleasant tasting and nice smelling.  It may be used all month without cycling.  Additional PM and/or PC may be cycled while using this combo at the same time, but then a smaller amount should be used because of what's already in the combo.  And you should only use them if you are sure they are good for you, as explained in previous posts.  They might not always be helpful for NBE, and might even be harmful to it.

Likewise as explained earlier you should be in good health before using this combo, with no hormonal problems, no mood or anxiety issues, no metabolic disorders, not hypoglycemic, and at least a B cup before starting (or perhaps a large A for some).


Powder:
Combine in a quart jar and shake.  Take 1-1/4 tsp. a day, dissolved well in liquid.  You may stir, let it sit in liquid for a few minutes and stir again if that's easier for you than long stirring.  If major discomfort occurs amount may be halved, but then be sure to half the cream too.  If major discomfort continues, it might not be a good idea to use this combo at all.

Cream, oil portion:
  • 1 oz. cetearyl glucoside : https://www.etsy.com/transaction/1065427...6f55fd737b (2 orders)
  • 1.5 oz or 40 grams cocoa butter (A solid 3 tablespoons, more if there is air in the spoon): Many easy to find sources online.  There are other skin uses for the extra and it keeps for a long time.
  • 1.5 oz or 40 grams flax oil (3 tbsp): Many easy to find sources online.  Can take the extra internally for health.
  • 1.5 oz o4 40 grams rice bran oil (3 tbsp): Many easy to find sources online.  Can cook with the extra as a super healthy vegetable oil.
  • 2.5 grams xanthan gum, or about 1 tsp: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0014UH...detailpage .  The extra makes a good thickener.  To thicken other creams or sauces thoroughly combine 1/4 tsp gum with a tiny bit of any oil until coated.  Mix with 1 cup of liquid.  Use more for increased thickness.
  • 2 oz. saw palmetto extract salve 25% fatty acids: http://www.zooscape.com/cgi-bin/maitred/...514321/r11

Cream, water portion:
Cream Directions:
1.  Put a pan on the lowest heat possible.  Drop in oil portion ingredients and stir until xanthan gum is well mixed.
2.  While the solids are melting combine the water portion ingredients in another container.
3.  Stir the oil portion rapidly to help it melt, then remove from heat once fully melted.
4.  Pour oil portion into water portion and mix thoroughly.
5.  Transfer to the jar or jars you wish to store the cream in.  Refrigeration is optional, but might be safer for whatever you don't plan on using this month.

Apply 1 teaspoon a day to the breasts using your finger tips.  Work from outward to inward in a circular motion.  You may use this cream for massage if desired.  If major discomfort occurs amount may be halved, but then be sure to half the powder too.  If major discomfort continues, it might not be a good idea to use this combo at all.  If you want to apply something more later in the day you may use as much of your extra cocoa butter, flax oil and rice bran oil as you like.

Purpose:
  • Shatavari: NBE, hormone balancing, cycle maintaining.
  • PM: NBE.  Kept low to avoid disrupting your cycle or hormones, plus other ingredients help counteract any issues.
  • Vitex: NBE.  Provides a little added progesterone but only during luteal to maintain your cycle.  Along with the little bit of PC it balances out the little bit of PM.

  • Water: Dissolves cream ingredients.
  • Cetearyl Glucoside: Allows oil to mix with water.  I made sure to pick a naturally occurring and safe emulsifier with no harmful effects as far as I could find.
  • Cocoa Butter: Saturated fat gets absorbed and stored for NBE.  Moisturizes to prevent stretch marks.
  • Flax Oil: Essential fatty acids gets absorbed and stored for NBE.  Moisturizes to prevent stretch marks.  Different fat types from the cocoa butter.
  • Rice Bran Oil: Preserves these fats so they stay in the breasts longer without leaving.
  • Xanthan gum: Natural thickener.
  • Saw palmetto extract: NBE.  Anti-androgen.
  • PC: NBE.  Balances out the little bit of PM.
  • Hyaluronic Acid: Collagen, lift, firmness, minor NBE.  Moisturizes to prevent stretch marks.  Swells up in between the collagen rather than forming the collagen itself.
  • MSM: Collagen forming, lift, firmness, minor NBE.  It's a small amount so you may consume more internally if you like.
  • Grapefruit seed extract: Preservative.

Haven't gotten around to this but I should.  Regarding this recipe.  Geminidoll tried it: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.ph...#pid174233
She grew but she also gained weight.  Though this was after a lot of weight loss.

Looking back I think the PM should be cut in half or less, maybe 1/4.  The PC to 1/4 or less, maybe removed if the PM is low enough.  They're relatively low compared to what some use, but still a little high.The shatavari is suspect too.  It might be kept the same or halved.  The other ingredients shouldn't cause weight gain.

Also hyaluronic acid and MSM aren't well absorbed, so they could be taken out along with all the water, cetearyl glucoside and xanthan gum.  Then this becomes an oil and the amount necessary is way less.  Or the cocoa butter, flax oil and rice bran oil may be increased if desired in place of the water.  You can leave it as an oil or if you want an oil based thickener for a salve you can use a little beeswax.  If all water portions are removed then the preservative isn't necessary either, but even if you leave in a little PC you may want a little preservative to be safe.  Oil loves to mold when emulsified with water.
Straight male into nutrition and herbs.

A good NBE program: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=23076
IGF and NBE: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=27347
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