[EllaC]

SOY - people who consume the most soy have the lowest cases of BC in the world so they say. So this must be a healthy dose of plant estros?

And yet Asians are soo tiny and petite (in a good way) no offence meant.

Good point ELLA, I think I've also read that menopause isn't an issue because of the regular intake of soy (we're speaking throughout their lives).

And isn't estrogen prescribed throughout menopause? (I may be off base on this one) but if that's the case then its healthy to keep our estrogen levels up then? Westerners tend not to eat a lot of plant based estros and we suffer the most from menopause - you have me thinking.
But again they take soy as a "whole food" source and not isolated. I wonder if this applies to all sources of phytoestrogens? We need to be consuming them in their pure form and not isolated out.

[Lotus]

That and progesterone therapy, I think what I've learned about E is how it affects people differently, even dudes!. On average, and it does vary throughout Asia but soy intake is roughly about 10-12 grams. Which isn't a lot in comparison say to the amount of protein that would be consumed daily, so it does tend to be misleading.

The US is the biggest producer of soy believe it or not!

[peggy]

Lotus and Ella, there are herbs that are estrogenic but can still be taken for estrogen dominance, like fenugreek and alfalfa as they contain a lot of diosgenin (phyto-progesterone). Also positive for estrogen dominance is EPO (evening primrose oil) and yarrow, wild yam and lady's mantle.

Hops on the other hand can worsen an estrogen dominance, because it can lower progesterone.

Red clover is also not ideal, as it is very estrogenic.

[EllaC]

Lotus and Ella, there are herbs that are estrogenic but can still be taken for estrogen dominance, like fenugreek and alfalfa as they contain a lot of diosgenin. Also positive for estrogen dominance is EPO (evening primrose oil) and yarrow.

Hops on the other hand can worsen an estrogen dominance, because it can lower progesterone.

Wow thanks peggy. Are there any others you know of? Im glad im subsribed to this thread so can always refer back
Alfalfa aside from being a super food is suoposed to help build mammary tissue like goats rue.

[Lotus]

Lotus and Ella, there are herbs that are estrogenic but can still be taken for estrogen dominance, like fenugreek and alfalfa as they contain a lot of diosgenin. Also positive for estrogen dominance is EPO (evening primrose oil) and yarrow.

Hops on the other hand can worsen an estrogen dominance, because it can lower progesterone.

Thanks Peggy,

So we're saying it could look like this,


Estrogenic herbs
1) Fenugreek/Alfalfa/EPO -for Estro-dominance -----(FN ??)
2) Pueraria Mirifica for regular use

Just trying to give options for different estrogenic herbs so we can complete the list,

A solid cycle
1 estrogenic herb
1 pro-hormone
1 pro-aromatase
1 potentiator (vitamins/minerals, etc)
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=17830

[Ceci82]

Great thread Lotus, one question: you have mentioned white tea as a T blocker. Have this any negative side effect ? eg Spearmint and iron depletion. Thank you

[Ceci82]

Can people summarize their programmes that gave success? Ie your lovely self lotus. You have such beautiful success.

Mochaccino tried to do this : http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=14101

[Lotus]

Great thread Lotus, one question: you have mentioned white tea as a T blocker. Have this any negative side effect ? eg Spearmint and iron depletion. Thank you

Hi Ceci,

It's funny I have iron on my mind, lol. I was just remembering that fenugreek interfere's with the absorption of iron, so be careful if you are anemic. Ok sorry, just had to get that down, white tea contains 3x more anti-oxidants then green tea, so that makes it one of the healthiest teas, ok I'm gonna get all techno here so here it goes, first nobody really talks about green tea because there's so much misinformation out there about it. Researchers confirmed that green and white tea increases SHBG (Sex Hormone Binding Globulin) which prevents T into converting to DHT. Let me state that's my opinion based on reports and literature out there, and conversely you'll find opposing reports and literature.

But why I think white tea is a more effective T blocker is from those same reports,

White and green tea suppress testosterone glucuronidation via UGT2B17 enzyme inhibition.
Inhibition of UGT2B17 may raise circulating levels of testosterone.
Inhibition of UGT2B17 may alter the T/E ratio.


Spearmint demonstrated significant reductions in free and total testosterone levels and increases in luteinizing hormone and follicle stimulating hormone concentrations. These alterations are consistent with an improvement in PCOS. Trials have found that peppermint and spearmint teas inhibit the absorption of dietary minerals such as iron. For those who need extra iron, it’s obviously a harmful interaction. But most men and post menopausal women do not need additional iron and in fact, reducing iron levels may be advantageous.
http://www.healthyfellow.com/290/mint-tea-warning/

[Lotus]

Can people summarize their programmes that gave success? Ie your lovely self lotus. You have such beautiful success.

Mochaccino tried to do this : http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=14101

Well, there's certainly no disclaimers or exclusions to this experiment, so I promise all are welcome to share!

[Ceci82]

Thanks for you reply.  Recently I´ve learnt that FG interfere with calcium absorption (btw you posted the link http://www.anagen.net/fenuin.htm ) I didn´t know that there was an iron absorption problem with FG too. It's  really disappointing but thanks for telling us.
For the other hand I´m very glad about white tea as a T blocker !

PS: you´re great