28-02-2016, 00:09
SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006 at 5:30 PM Helen (Helen_N)
SugarQ dear, I would be really grateful if I could have your opinion on NBE breaks, I am not convinced that this "theory" on breaks after 3months on NBE stands...
Anyone else please feel free to give me your opinion on it, I would really appreciate any input, I need it, and please don't get me wrong, I will just start with my first thoughts on this...
After reading what Lucille had to say in her flat2fab book on this, I am not convinced, this all seems very theoretical and not supported by any real evidence...
"After three cycles, the herbs begin losing their effectiveness and breast growth screeches to a halt and by taking a break, the estrogen receptors are given a chance to clear out and regain their sensitivity to the herbs..."
After 3 cycles? For everyone? But we are all different and respond to these kind of nutrients differently... If this is true, wouldn't it happen to different people at different times, not necessarily after 3 cycles? And what does this "giving the receptors the chance to clear out" mean?
It is stated that "when estrogen levels get too high, further breast growth is sabotaged." But why would they get high? Aren't phytoestrogens supposed to bring and maintain the correct balance???
Do we really "adapt" to herbs? Does "the body get used to its routine and stop responding, after about 3 months"??? How can this be analogous to the example of "muscles adapting to a particular exercise and no longer responding the way they used to"???
Okay, breaks might be helpful for some women, but how can this be promoted to a general rule? Wouldn't it be a risk to interrupt the progress with the possibility of even losing any growth gained so far? Besides, how could one recommend a break to someone who was getting results? On the other hand, if, say, nothing has happened in the last 6 weeks or something of that kind, wouldn't it be more sensible to consider a break then, perhaps???
I can't help but notice that, even though some proper references are given at several parts of the text, no sources at all are given for this part, no scientific papers to support these arguments...
What is your opinion SugarQ? I would really really appreciate your advice on this. What does everyone else think? I know I have only just referred to the flat2fab book, but I know several girls in here are also having/considering NBE breaks, so I am very interested to see what you all think about this.
Sorry for the long, confusing and (confused!) post girls, thanks so much for reading, and I would love to hear from you.
In anticipation,
Luv, Helen xx
Lisa 121
(Login Lisa121)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 7:17 PM
Hi Helen, I haven't read the book and I personally don't break after three months. I do think that the body does get used to the herbs though and that a break now and again is necessary, after 6 months I would always put one in and again at the 9 or 12 month mark, but that is just me personally.
You notice when your body does adjust to the herbs, that is usually when the tingles get less and growth slows down. That's when people increase dosages which usually helps, but if dosages get too high it is time for a break.
I think that everyone is different but I also don't think that putting in a two week break or so after three cycles would do any harm.
I think everyone should go with their gut on this, and I don't think that there is a rule on how and when to break.
Take care,
Lisa
Tiger Lily
(Login tiger.lily)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 7:26 PM
My booby growth project means eat good booby food and do good booby massage every day. Since started in Sep I had no break and grown a cup size up to now. I didn't hear any Taiwan girls breaking as you mentioned. Maybe a Western idea only, I don't know. I always say follow project every day without any fail.
Anonymous
(Login seemonkeyme)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 9:03 PM
Heyyy Momma!!!
I really don't know whatthe thery is behind it, But I do beleive after takeing herbs for a while your body can become imune to it. You know when you take some certin med's and you are on them for a while well your body get's used to it and after a while will need more to maintane. and if you take alot of herbs you can become sick. So by takeing breaks it gives your body a chance to hmmm how do I put this? to regroup??? So when you start up again you won't have to consume more than you need. OHboy I hope this makes sense. hoEB please correct me if I'm wrong. I know when I had broken my arm years ago I was given pain killers. well after being on them for a month they started to become worthless so I had to double up on them to get any effect and I think the same thing happens with herbs. I hope i'm right really don't want to give you wrong info. I'm sure hoEB can explain alot better than me. Good Luck Momma
love ya Lisaxxxx
Sherri
(Login Miss_Sherri)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 9:13 PM
I agree. I have been on NBE for almost three months. Well I did just massages only for the first month, and then began to add herbs in the second month, so I've been on the herbs for almost two months now. I am pleased with my growth so far, and I do not plan to break, unless I feel nothing is happening. I dont feel as many "tingles" as I did in the first month, but I still have very sore nipples almost everyday, and that to me is a sign that the herbs are doing something. I feel much more full than I did as well. Only if this all stops and I feel no pains or anything and see no addition growth for a couple of weeks will I take a break. And even then I will probably first try ramping up, and then if I still see no difference I will break. I just don't see the purpose in breaking if I have these pains and feel like these herbs are working so well for me. Why would I do that? Seems to me like a foolish idea. Wouldn't you want to keep doing what you're doing if it is working for you?
Lizzie
(Login LizzieT)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 11:12 PM
Hi Helen
I've been on my routine for 3 months but last week I decided to take at least a month's break because even though I was growing I had terrible acne, mood swings and hair thinning. Since I came off the herbs less than a week ago my boobs have almost completely deflated which is almost worse than if they had never grown. So my personal opinion is if your routine is working stay on it!!
Best of luck.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 2:01 AM
there are 3 main reasons why women go on breaks. 1) they read the f2f book and think that their growth will stop if they dont take a break or 2 ) women get freaked out when they have changes in their menstral cycle.3) women believe that there is some danger with using herbs for too long without breaks.
Now when women ask i normally would say every 3 months but not for the reasons lucille stated. my reasoning is that after 3 months most women will retain some growth (some growth will just be welling and will go away eventually but usually after 3 months something will stay). so that would be a saftest and earliest time to take a break.so if women want to go on a break i would say that they should wait at least 3 months cause any earlier they would have just waited their money and time and end up risking what little growth they have.
another reason i would recommend breaks is if someone has gone for at least 3 months without any progress. with herbs, the side effect is NBE. like with other meds, people start taking them and many will develop side effects or reactions which will eventually go away or be reduced as their bodies gets accustomed to the meds. the same goes for herbs. over time if we take the herbs on the regular basis our bodies stop responding (as strongly) to them. so growth spirts and pains dont happen as often and for some women growth can even stop comepletly. now its best to wait 6 months to consider yourself in a stall but i understand that women are impatient about their NBE progress and even some women freak out after only 2 weeks without any growth so its hard for most women to imagin waiting 6 months on a routine that doesnt seem to work for them. so that how i get the 3 months.
one of the worst reasonings to go on a break would be becuase of cycle changes. one common side effect of NBE would be a delayed or no period. may women freak out right away and think that they are in some kind of health crisis because they end up loosing their period. one common reason of the delay is prolactin. most of the popular NBE herbs stimulate prolactin and regular massages stimulate prolactin. prolactin will naturally stop or delay a menstral cycle and there really isnt anything dangerouse about that. you are not even in any danger if you are on a routine for a year or two and have a no show of Aunti flow. you dont need a break to make sure you get your period but i would only recommmend it if breaks helps to get growth and the only way women would know if it helps is if they try it. with the delay of a menstral cycle progesterone and estrogen levels dont fall as sharply or as low as they should and its the high progesterone and estrogen levels during the luteal phase that causes breast to swell and enlarge. when they drop that causes shrinkage. this sorta mimics a pregnancy. now if you take breaks or you stop taking herbs part way though your cycle then you allow your the estrogen and progesterone levels to drop and that can cause some shrinkage. a delayed cycle isnt a big deal but if you stop getting your period all together you just need to make sure you not really pregnant or their are not other health condition (you may or maynot no about) that could be causing it. other then that you dont need a break at all. you can go up to a 9-12 months if you wish(9 months is the longest women do naturally go without a cycle so that would be a safe zone). now there is a conern if a women develops earier and frequent cycles cause that is hard to explain away or reason with. in these cases i would stop and take a break right away.
i dont want anyone to take my advise as the be all end all in this discussion. im no doctor but thats where i stand when it comes to breaks. i normally us th 3 month rule with the understanding that most women would have a heard time waiting much longer then that while troubleshoot problems with their routine. i only recommend breaks if there are no growth signs but women must understand that growth doesnt happen in regular intervals. there are spirts of growth. you may not grow for 1 or 2 months then all of a sudden, BAM!!! you grow 1' in a month. there are also times where women would shrink and that is common and unavoidable. now when it comes to our bodies getting too accustom to the herbs thats natural. they usually will still work but sensations will come and go , growth spirts may come every 4-6month instread of every 2 months but its better to have slower progress then to have too many breaks and end up causing your own shrinkage or firther delay in progress.
breaks are also a safty net. some women feel like herbs may cause harm to their bodies if they use it for too long and if they feel safe with taking regular breaks then fine. i dont feel its needed but i wouldnt bet anyone's life on that one so do what makes sense for you. it better to be safe then sorry. if you feel weird or you have pains that are unusual then get checked out right away. or even stop the routine.
many women on this forum like eve, amber, cheryl go for longer then 6 months on a routine and that seemed to work well for them. on the beboard there is pammy and wenonae who grew without taking too many regular breaks. on the greenbush forum there is tere who went on a routine for almost a year and a half straight and she grew well also. on the flip side there are some women who say they get spirts during their regular breaks so everyone is different.
in summary you dont need a break but if they work for you then dont fix what aint broken.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 3:04 AM
in the f2f book lucille recommends taking Progesterone cream during the one month breaks. IMO thats just a wait of money. progesterone cream needs at least 3 months to truely make a difference so i wouldnt bother. if you want to try the cream before you start herbs then i would use the cream for at least 3 months before starting herbs. also progesterone will only help nbe in two ways. if you take strong estrogens like PM, red clover, soy, licorice root etc that will help to clear up keeping HIGH estrogen levels in check and keep the reseptors acting at its full potential. but if you are not taking alot of strong phytoestrogens and you have normal to low estrogen levels then you dont need the progesterone at all.
use the cream if you have excess levels of estrogen or you are progesterone deficient. there are some key symtoms that someone posted on this forum help figure out where your hormone levels fall into.
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 10:31 PM
Lisa121, TigerLily, Lisaxsxsxs, Sherri & Lizzie :
-----------------
THANK YOU SO MUCH, my lovely ladies, for your fast and helpful response
SugarQ :
-------
A BIG BIG THANK YOU for taking the time to provide me with your explanations, I trust your knowledge and good analytical thinking. Lucille's reasoning just didn't do it for me, so got a bit worried there as to how all this breaking-from-NBE-"rule" stands...
I believe that assuming that 3-month break is a necessity for everyone (cause this is how it is described by Lucille) is wrong. Simply because you cannot guarantee that everyone will respond to herbs the same way, so if there is a need for a break, it will come at different points in time for different women.
I do find it more sensible to break in 3months IF you've seen no progress that far. I am not sure about the body adapting to herbs, same way as pain killers lose their effectiveness when one "gets used" to them, this analogy is just not convincing enough to me. The "analgesic rebound" is linked to changes in nerve cell receptors: decrease of the number of the brain's opiate receptors (down-regulation) if a person takes narcotics frequently or in large amounts (narcotic analgesics work by acting like the brain's own opiates), makes us desensitized to narcotics and they lose their effectiveness. Same way estrogen receptors can be down-regulated IF estrogen levels are too high... but in this case isn't this what we actually WANT if estrogen levels are too high and this ensures the right hormonal balance? Does this mean that we will also become less sensitive to phytoestrogens? Feels contradictive, I need to give this a lot more thought as I do not quite understand it... However, the way you put it, SugarQ, describing NBE as the "side-effect" of herbs, and the body stopping "reacting" to them, is in fact interesting...we don't stop responding to the nutrients, we stop "reacting" to them... Something else there for me to think about...
Molly
(Login MollyH)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 16 2006, 9:32 AM
The idea of breaking after 3 months seems strange to me, because in some cases it can take the best part of 3 months before someone starts to see any results. Therefore, in those cases, if they took a break after 3 months, they would be stopping taking the herbs just when they had started to see a benefit from them. In herbalism, I think setting down rules that are expected to apply to everyone is always wrong. Herbalism works best when each person taking herbs is treated as an individual and the focus is on how that person is responding to what they have been given, rather than following some general rule that is meant to apply to everyone.
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
I agree
May 16 2006, 2:43 PM
Actually, this is a very good point Molly, thank you. In fact, in my case, I didn't feel any "signs" (e.g. pains/tingles) until I was well into my 2nd month, and only just noticed the first visible change in the 2nd half of the 3rd month... For slow-response cases like mine, a break just wouldn't make any sense.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 16 2006, 5:41 PM
you guys are right. if you are growing good while on herbs then i wouldnt break cause you usually get spoil a good thing. the only time i would break is if for what ever reason you stop growing for a long time. also the body gets down regulated when it has too much of any estrogen. thats one of the reasons why women with high estrogen levels dont keep growing new breast tissue. women with already large breasts tend to high much higher estrogen levels and sometimes if they go on a birth control or take proegesterone their breasts will start to grow again because the progesterone reactiviates the estrogen receptors as well as causes the mammary glands to enlarge. the only question i have about phytoestrogens is that can a balance be achieved when using them that it would stimulate breast growth in some women. and i guess right now i can only say that its possible but still relativly unknown.
Cheryl
(Login Cheryl.)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 18 2006, 8:55 AM
Regarding the comment about "when estrogen levels get too high, further breast growth is sabotaged", my understanding has always been that estrogen levels getting too high is not something that should happen. I know these things don't work perfectly for everyone and there may be women where estrogen levels do get too high, but I've always believed that normally this won't happen with phytoestrogens. I'm not an expert, but if this comment is in the Flat2Fab book, I think the book may be flawed on this point. (PS. For what it's worth, personally I've never taken a break).
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 18 2006, 11:09 AM
SugarQ you are right hon, exactly: why fix something that ain't broken ?!?
Cheryl, this was exactly what I thought too, that high levels of estrogen won't happen while you're on phytoestrogens, so... the flat2fab book confused me there... the reasoning is flawed (especially making this 3-month break theory a "rule" for everyone), SugarQ gave a very good analysis of the correct possible reasoning behind breaks, sounds very sensible to me this way... and it is really re-assuring when girls like you, Eve, Amber have grown so lovely even without breaks.
Best (boobie)wishes,
Helen xx
Wild Flower
(Login wild.flower)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 23 2006, 6:22 AM
Has anyone ever found that their growth came "screeching to a halt" after 3 months (as the theory says?) I can't remember anyone saying that. In any event, 3 months doesn't seem like a very long time to me.
sugar2spice
(Login sugar2spice)
even better
April 24 2007, 11:39 PM
Just the information I was looking for! I've been getting feedback on breaks and just when I thought breaking would be best, Snowflake turned my mind around. Actually, I became a little bit confused, partly convinced at first. I even wrote vortexhealth.com, from which I just ordered Wonderup. They also said that breaking was not necessary unless no growth was experienced for a long period or if it stopped for a long time. I thank you all for the help!!
May 14 2006 at 5:30 PM Helen (Helen_N)
SugarQ dear, I would be really grateful if I could have your opinion on NBE breaks, I am not convinced that this "theory" on breaks after 3months on NBE stands...
Anyone else please feel free to give me your opinion on it, I would really appreciate any input, I need it, and please don't get me wrong, I will just start with my first thoughts on this...
After reading what Lucille had to say in her flat2fab book on this, I am not convinced, this all seems very theoretical and not supported by any real evidence...
"After three cycles, the herbs begin losing their effectiveness and breast growth screeches to a halt and by taking a break, the estrogen receptors are given a chance to clear out and regain their sensitivity to the herbs..."
After 3 cycles? For everyone? But we are all different and respond to these kind of nutrients differently... If this is true, wouldn't it happen to different people at different times, not necessarily after 3 cycles? And what does this "giving the receptors the chance to clear out" mean?
It is stated that "when estrogen levels get too high, further breast growth is sabotaged." But why would they get high? Aren't phytoestrogens supposed to bring and maintain the correct balance???
Do we really "adapt" to herbs? Does "the body get used to its routine and stop responding, after about 3 months"??? How can this be analogous to the example of "muscles adapting to a particular exercise and no longer responding the way they used to"???
Okay, breaks might be helpful for some women, but how can this be promoted to a general rule? Wouldn't it be a risk to interrupt the progress with the possibility of even losing any growth gained so far? Besides, how could one recommend a break to someone who was getting results? On the other hand, if, say, nothing has happened in the last 6 weeks or something of that kind, wouldn't it be more sensible to consider a break then, perhaps???
I can't help but notice that, even though some proper references are given at several parts of the text, no sources at all are given for this part, no scientific papers to support these arguments...
What is your opinion SugarQ? I would really really appreciate your advice on this. What does everyone else think? I know I have only just referred to the flat2fab book, but I know several girls in here are also having/considering NBE breaks, so I am very interested to see what you all think about this.
Sorry for the long, confusing and (confused!) post girls, thanks so much for reading, and I would love to hear from you.
In anticipation,
Luv, Helen xx
Lisa 121
(Login Lisa121)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 7:17 PM
Hi Helen, I haven't read the book and I personally don't break after three months. I do think that the body does get used to the herbs though and that a break now and again is necessary, after 6 months I would always put one in and again at the 9 or 12 month mark, but that is just me personally.
You notice when your body does adjust to the herbs, that is usually when the tingles get less and growth slows down. That's when people increase dosages which usually helps, but if dosages get too high it is time for a break.
I think that everyone is different but I also don't think that putting in a two week break or so after three cycles would do any harm.
I think everyone should go with their gut on this, and I don't think that there is a rule on how and when to break.
Take care,
Lisa
Tiger Lily
(Login tiger.lily)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 7:26 PM
My booby growth project means eat good booby food and do good booby massage every day. Since started in Sep I had no break and grown a cup size up to now. I didn't hear any Taiwan girls breaking as you mentioned. Maybe a Western idea only, I don't know. I always say follow project every day without any fail.
Anonymous
(Login seemonkeyme)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 9:03 PM
Heyyy Momma!!!
I really don't know whatthe thery is behind it, But I do beleive after takeing herbs for a while your body can become imune to it. You know when you take some certin med's and you are on them for a while well your body get's used to it and after a while will need more to maintane. and if you take alot of herbs you can become sick. So by takeing breaks it gives your body a chance to hmmm how do I put this? to regroup??? So when you start up again you won't have to consume more than you need. OHboy I hope this makes sense. hoEB please correct me if I'm wrong. I know when I had broken my arm years ago I was given pain killers. well after being on them for a month they started to become worthless so I had to double up on them to get any effect and I think the same thing happens with herbs. I hope i'm right really don't want to give you wrong info. I'm sure hoEB can explain alot better than me. Good Luck Momma
love ya LisaxxxxSherri
(Login Miss_Sherri)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 9:13 PM
I agree. I have been on NBE for almost three months. Well I did just massages only for the first month, and then began to add herbs in the second month, so I've been on the herbs for almost two months now. I am pleased with my growth so far, and I do not plan to break, unless I feel nothing is happening. I dont feel as many "tingles" as I did in the first month, but I still have very sore nipples almost everyday, and that to me is a sign that the herbs are doing something. I feel much more full than I did as well. Only if this all stops and I feel no pains or anything and see no addition growth for a couple of weeks will I take a break. And even then I will probably first try ramping up, and then if I still see no difference I will break. I just don't see the purpose in breaking if I have these pains and feel like these herbs are working so well for me. Why would I do that? Seems to me like a foolish idea. Wouldn't you want to keep doing what you're doing if it is working for you?
Lizzie
(Login LizzieT)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 14 2006, 11:12 PM
Hi Helen
I've been on my routine for 3 months but last week I decided to take at least a month's break because even though I was growing I had terrible acne, mood swings and hair thinning. Since I came off the herbs less than a week ago my boobs have almost completely deflated which is almost worse than if they had never grown. So my personal opinion is if your routine is working stay on it!!
Best of luck.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 2:01 AM
there are 3 main reasons why women go on breaks. 1) they read the f2f book and think that their growth will stop if they dont take a break or 2 ) women get freaked out when they have changes in their menstral cycle.3) women believe that there is some danger with using herbs for too long without breaks.
Now when women ask i normally would say every 3 months but not for the reasons lucille stated. my reasoning is that after 3 months most women will retain some growth (some growth will just be welling and will go away eventually but usually after 3 months something will stay). so that would be a saftest and earliest time to take a break.so if women want to go on a break i would say that they should wait at least 3 months cause any earlier they would have just waited their money and time and end up risking what little growth they have.
another reason i would recommend breaks is if someone has gone for at least 3 months without any progress. with herbs, the side effect is NBE. like with other meds, people start taking them and many will develop side effects or reactions which will eventually go away or be reduced as their bodies gets accustomed to the meds. the same goes for herbs. over time if we take the herbs on the regular basis our bodies stop responding (as strongly) to them. so growth spirts and pains dont happen as often and for some women growth can even stop comepletly. now its best to wait 6 months to consider yourself in a stall but i understand that women are impatient about their NBE progress and even some women freak out after only 2 weeks without any growth so its hard for most women to imagin waiting 6 months on a routine that doesnt seem to work for them. so that how i get the 3 months.
one of the worst reasonings to go on a break would be becuase of cycle changes. one common side effect of NBE would be a delayed or no period. may women freak out right away and think that they are in some kind of health crisis because they end up loosing their period. one common reason of the delay is prolactin. most of the popular NBE herbs stimulate prolactin and regular massages stimulate prolactin. prolactin will naturally stop or delay a menstral cycle and there really isnt anything dangerouse about that. you are not even in any danger if you are on a routine for a year or two and have a no show of Aunti flow. you dont need a break to make sure you get your period but i would only recommmend it if breaks helps to get growth and the only way women would know if it helps is if they try it. with the delay of a menstral cycle progesterone and estrogen levels dont fall as sharply or as low as they should and its the high progesterone and estrogen levels during the luteal phase that causes breast to swell and enlarge. when they drop that causes shrinkage. this sorta mimics a pregnancy. now if you take breaks or you stop taking herbs part way though your cycle then you allow your the estrogen and progesterone levels to drop and that can cause some shrinkage. a delayed cycle isnt a big deal but if you stop getting your period all together you just need to make sure you not really pregnant or their are not other health condition (you may or maynot no about) that could be causing it. other then that you dont need a break at all. you can go up to a 9-12 months if you wish(9 months is the longest women do naturally go without a cycle so that would be a safe zone). now there is a conern if a women develops earier and frequent cycles cause that is hard to explain away or reason with. in these cases i would stop and take a break right away.
i dont want anyone to take my advise as the be all end all in this discussion. im no doctor but thats where i stand when it comes to breaks. i normally us th 3 month rule with the understanding that most women would have a heard time waiting much longer then that while troubleshoot problems with their routine. i only recommend breaks if there are no growth signs but women must understand that growth doesnt happen in regular intervals. there are spirts of growth. you may not grow for 1 or 2 months then all of a sudden, BAM!!! you grow 1' in a month. there are also times where women would shrink and that is common and unavoidable. now when it comes to our bodies getting too accustom to the herbs thats natural. they usually will still work but sensations will come and go , growth spirts may come every 4-6month instread of every 2 months but its better to have slower progress then to have too many breaks and end up causing your own shrinkage or firther delay in progress.
breaks are also a safty net. some women feel like herbs may cause harm to their bodies if they use it for too long and if they feel safe with taking regular breaks then fine. i dont feel its needed but i wouldnt bet anyone's life on that one so do what makes sense for you. it better to be safe then sorry. if you feel weird or you have pains that are unusual then get checked out right away. or even stop the routine.
many women on this forum like eve, amber, cheryl go for longer then 6 months on a routine and that seemed to work well for them. on the beboard there is pammy and wenonae who grew without taking too many regular breaks. on the greenbush forum there is tere who went on a routine for almost a year and a half straight and she grew well also. on the flip side there are some women who say they get spirts during their regular breaks so everyone is different.
in summary you dont need a break but if they work for you then dont fix what aint broken.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 3:04 AM
in the f2f book lucille recommends taking Progesterone cream during the one month breaks. IMO thats just a wait of money. progesterone cream needs at least 3 months to truely make a difference so i wouldnt bother. if you want to try the cream before you start herbs then i would use the cream for at least 3 months before starting herbs. also progesterone will only help nbe in two ways. if you take strong estrogens like PM, red clover, soy, licorice root etc that will help to clear up keeping HIGH estrogen levels in check and keep the reseptors acting at its full potential. but if you are not taking alot of strong phytoestrogens and you have normal to low estrogen levels then you dont need the progesterone at all.
use the cream if you have excess levels of estrogen or you are progesterone deficient. there are some key symtoms that someone posted on this forum help figure out where your hormone levels fall into.
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 15 2006, 10:31 PM
Lisa121, TigerLily, Lisaxsxsxs, Sherri & Lizzie :
-----------------
THANK YOU SO MUCH, my lovely ladies, for your fast and helpful response
SugarQ :
-------
A BIG BIG THANK YOU for taking the time to provide me with your explanations, I trust your knowledge and good analytical thinking. Lucille's reasoning just didn't do it for me, so got a bit worried there as to how all this breaking-from-NBE-"rule" stands...
I believe that assuming that 3-month break is a necessity for everyone (cause this is how it is described by Lucille) is wrong. Simply because you cannot guarantee that everyone will respond to herbs the same way, so if there is a need for a break, it will come at different points in time for different women.
I do find it more sensible to break in 3months IF you've seen no progress that far. I am not sure about the body adapting to herbs, same way as pain killers lose their effectiveness when one "gets used" to them, this analogy is just not convincing enough to me. The "analgesic rebound" is linked to changes in nerve cell receptors: decrease of the number of the brain's opiate receptors (down-regulation) if a person takes narcotics frequently or in large amounts (narcotic analgesics work by acting like the brain's own opiates), makes us desensitized to narcotics and they lose their effectiveness. Same way estrogen receptors can be down-regulated IF estrogen levels are too high... but in this case isn't this what we actually WANT if estrogen levels are too high and this ensures the right hormonal balance? Does this mean that we will also become less sensitive to phytoestrogens? Feels contradictive, I need to give this a lot more thought as I do not quite understand it... However, the way you put it, SugarQ, describing NBE as the "side-effect" of herbs, and the body stopping "reacting" to them, is in fact interesting...we don't stop responding to the nutrients, we stop "reacting" to them... Something else there for me to think about...
Molly
(Login MollyH)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 16 2006, 9:32 AM
The idea of breaking after 3 months seems strange to me, because in some cases it can take the best part of 3 months before someone starts to see any results. Therefore, in those cases, if they took a break after 3 months, they would be stopping taking the herbs just when they had started to see a benefit from them. In herbalism, I think setting down rules that are expected to apply to everyone is always wrong. Herbalism works best when each person taking herbs is treated as an individual and the focus is on how that person is responding to what they have been given, rather than following some general rule that is meant to apply to everyone.
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
I agree
May 16 2006, 2:43 PM
Actually, this is a very good point Molly, thank you. In fact, in my case, I didn't feel any "signs" (e.g. pains/tingles) until I was well into my 2nd month, and only just noticed the first visible change in the 2nd half of the 3rd month... For slow-response cases like mine, a break just wouldn't make any sense.
SugarQ
(Login SugarQ)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 16 2006, 5:41 PM
you guys are right. if you are growing good while on herbs then i wouldnt break cause you usually get spoil a good thing. the only time i would break is if for what ever reason you stop growing for a long time. also the body gets down regulated when it has too much of any estrogen. thats one of the reasons why women with high estrogen levels dont keep growing new breast tissue. women with already large breasts tend to high much higher estrogen levels and sometimes if they go on a birth control or take proegesterone their breasts will start to grow again because the progesterone reactiviates the estrogen receptors as well as causes the mammary glands to enlarge. the only question i have about phytoestrogens is that can a balance be achieved when using them that it would stimulate breast growth in some women. and i guess right now i can only say that its possible but still relativly unknown.
Cheryl
(Login Cheryl.)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 18 2006, 8:55 AM
Regarding the comment about "when estrogen levels get too high, further breast growth is sabotaged", my understanding has always been that estrogen levels getting too high is not something that should happen. I know these things don't work perfectly for everyone and there may be women where estrogen levels do get too high, but I've always believed that normally this won't happen with phytoestrogens. I'm not an expert, but if this comment is in the Flat2Fab book, I think the book may be flawed on this point. (PS. For what it's worth, personally I've never taken a break).
Helen
(Login Helen_N)
EVE MEMBERS
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 18 2006, 11:09 AM
SugarQ you are right hon, exactly: why fix something that ain't broken ?!?
Cheryl, this was exactly what I thought too, that high levels of estrogen won't happen while you're on phytoestrogens, so... the flat2fab book confused me there... the reasoning is flawed (especially making this 3-month break theory a "rule" for everyone), SugarQ gave a very good analysis of the correct possible reasoning behind breaks, sounds very sensible to me this way... and it is really re-assuring when girls like you, Eve, Amber have grown so lovely even without breaks.
Best (boobie)wishes,
Helen xx
Wild Flower
(Login wild.flower)
Re: SugarQ: NBE BREAKS: Need your opinion, ANYONE ELSE WELCOME
May 23 2006, 6:22 AM
Has anyone ever found that their growth came "screeching to a halt" after 3 months (as the theory says?) I can't remember anyone saying that. In any event, 3 months doesn't seem like a very long time to me.
sugar2spice
(Login sugar2spice)
even better
April 24 2007, 11:39 PM
Just the information I was looking for! I've been getting feedback on breaks and just when I thought breaking would be best, Snowflake turned my mind around. Actually, I became a little bit confused, partly convinced at first. I even wrote vortexhealth.com, from which I just ordered Wonderup. They also said that breaking was not necessary unless no growth was experienced for a long period or if it stopped for a long time. I thank you all for the help!!
...sorry, i'm sure i'm not the only one. i just need a little more on this one. thanks