[Grayson123]

Hi folks, I'm a 35 yo newbie here. It's good to meet everyone on the same path. Over the COVID quarantine period I've put on a few pounds and started losing it slowly. 

I want to get a slim thick look and am very pear shaped so I've got to fill in the top. I'm 5'3 and 140 lbs, but my goal weight is 120 lbs and I'd like to not flatten out in the chest. My approach is basically a kitchen sink technique where I'll try anything. 

My chest size is generally seen as a B cup. After discovering reddits measurement system I wear 32D Bras which work better, but that's certainly not what I look like. 

 I took a few pre mixed NBE pills in my early 20s, which were sold on home shopping networks, and they helped boost me up a little bit, but I never kept up with it possibly because I had less discipline. 

I started NBE last Friday and am hoping for the best yet with an attitude of outcome independence. 

So far I've been taking:

2 × 1600 mg Maca extract twice daily 
1 tbsp Caraway seed 

Since my FG shipped I'm switching today to 
2 x 1350 FG once daily 
2 x 1600 maca once daily 
1 tbsp caraway seed 
1 spironolactone

When the fennel arrives, I'll use that instead of caraway. I also ordered vitex and saw palmetto. SP will replace the Spiro when I run out. I do
o massage twice a day.

Another thing I've ordered and want to experiment with is domperidone. I know it's for lactation, but I'm going to combine it with Dronis birth control as per the first phase of that method, so that I won't lactate. I'm going to do this in the future because it takes 6 to 8 weeks for this stuff to ship from ADC. 

I will be taking less than 30 mg because above that amount, there may be a risk to the heart. However PubMed reminds me this risk is minimal. 

The reason why I think domperidone might work is because my guy friend got basically permanent manboobs from risperidone, which is an ADHD medication, when we were in high school, and that's also a dopamine antagonist. 

Let me know if you have any tips and tricks. 

Cheers, hope to hear from folks here.

[James98]

Fenugreek pills will add on fat all over your body. It has no innate ability to go just to your breasts. I recommend that fenugreek be used only as mixed with oil like almond oil and applied topically via massage to make it work where you want it.

[Grayson123]

Thanks, I should probably take more maca and Spiro and less FG. A lot of my supps are in the mail right now. 

What oral herb do you think is good for me, are vitex and red clover less fattening? I'm trying not to smell like FG, so taking it orally works best for me. I might get a PC cream. 

My main strategy I think should be to minimize androgens and keep prolactin high, but still below the level of someone lactating. That's why the Dom and the Spiro are an important part of my stack. 

What do you think?

[Lotus]

Fenugreek pills will add on fat all over your body. It has no innate ability to go just to your breasts. I recommend that fenugreek be used only as mixed with oil like almond oil and applied topically via massage to make it work where you want it.

Fenugreek does not add fat all over your body, I wish you'd stop saying this. Fenugreek is used to treat diabetes, lowers blood sugar too, so that's in complete opposite in what you claim james98.

Hi Grayson, welcome to BN, I'd say you're more of a C-cup to be quite honest.

In my research over the years on both forums of Breastnexus and Breastnexum I've posted science studies on Fenugreek, and the one that sticks out most on FG is how it increases estradiol. But you'd have to read the whole thread, there's some colorful parts yes, but you'll get a better sense of the true potential of FG.

Fenugreek increases estradiol
https://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=26172

Maca isn't something you'd want in your program if you're looking to slim down, it'll stimulate DHEA, that's going in the wrong direction.

[Grayson123]

Thanks! The fg thread is really interesting. Ive heard mixed reviews of maca, though I have a lot of it around.

Its funny how what we're doing here is the opposite of what bodybuilders do on Reddit. They hate prolactin and aromatase lol.

If FG has an aromatizing effect, do you think that it would work synergistically with the Spiro or would they kind of cancel each other out in this respect. I mean a lot of this is conjecture and FG seems to have multiple effects. Wdy think

[Lotus]

Its funny how what we're doing here is the opposite of what bodybuilders do on Reddit. They hate prolactin and aromatase lol.

Lol, they don't always hate aromatase. I've read before where some Body Builders use aromatase supps to increase their pectoral muscles and then slam on brakes with AI's (aromatase inhibitors) once they achieve their desired goal.

If FG has an aromatizing effect, do you t⅕hink that it would work synergistically with the Spiro or would they kind of cancel each other out in this respect. I mean a lot of this is conjecture and FG seems to have multiple effects. Wdy think

The main bioactive to FG us Diosgenin, much like found in wild yam. This is what promotes the breast grow Does having spiro (a minor aromatase agonist) help? maybe. I'm not a fan of spiro because of the worsening side effects I was having, namely spasms and electrolyte imbalances, other things too. Are you looking for an anti-androgen?

I've attached a post I kept mostly whole because of the content, hopefully it helps.

Perhaps you might have a gut flora imbalance?. Think about adding a probiotic like Bifidobacterium or Lactobacillus. Bloating could be a could be a sign you're not getting enough fiber, (soaked organic fenugreek seeds are high in fiber). As an added benefit Fenugreek has "diosgenin" which improves glucose metabolism and reduces inflammation. In my experience being on keto, I try to keep carbs @ 10-20 grams (no grains). As I've reported in other posts, ketones are involved in initiating the cAMP/CREB/PKA pathway, which is a pro-growth path. The question I would ask you is do you use ketone test strips to check ketone levrks.

Further more, in this study (below) serum estradiol levels increased 120% in the treatment group over the course of the study, from 131.22 pmol/L at baseline to 288.46 pmol/L at 90 days.
https://www.naturalmedicinejournal.com/j...l-symptoms


Diosgenin--a Growth Stimulator of Mammary Gland of Ovariectomized Mouse.
Abstract

Estrogenic action of diosgenin on the mammary epithelium of ovariectomized (OVX) mouse has been reported. Diosgenin when administered (sc) at the dose levels of 20 and 40 mg/kg body weight for a period of 15 days stimulated the growth of mammary epithelium. This was indicated by the increase in DNA content, increase in number of ducts and appearance of terminal endbuds. There was a significant increase in the mammary development scores in the presence of diosgenin. Concomitant treatment of estrogen and diosgenin showed augmentation of estrogenic effect of diosgenin especially at the higher dose level (40 mg/kg body wt). Diosgenin showed a lack of progesterogenic action as was apparent from the absence of alveolar development even in the presence of exogenous estrogen.

Wild Yam has diosgenin too.

[James98]

Just my personal observation, Lotus, I've seen women who have taken FG for 2+ years blow up like blimps.

[Grayson123]

I count calories very carefully and if FG causes me any issues I’ll switch to shatavari, which is pricier. If it doesn’t, no swear. I’m very serious about fitness now that the pandemic is over.

[Lotus]

I count calories very carefully and if FG causes me any issues I’ll switch to shatavari, which is pricier. If it doesn’t, no swear. I’m very serious about fitness now that the pandemic is over.

Thank you James for the Clarification. Hi Grayson, I'm attaching two studies on fenugreek. As I stated previously FG lowers insulin, so I can't agree with James assessment (with all due respect James). If indeed FG adds fat all over we'd have an epidemic the world over of overweight people just from using FG, and you'd have to track that clear back for centuries because that's how long fenugreek has been around, and that's simply not the case. 

Besides, there's no way James can say with certainty that it was FG that added fat all over because he didn't follow the people around insuring they stuck to strict protocols like they in a controlled science study, so again, i don't agree with his assessment. Please follow the science below. Triggering insulin increases appetite, AND testosterone (I didn't list that science though). Triggering insulin which spikes hunger and releases testosterone while trying to grow breasts is inefficient.

In the study about Fenugreek increasing estradiol, study participants only used 900mg. When I used FG (years ago) I didn't add fat all over, in fact I used 1800 mg and lost weight, most likely because it lowered my blood sugar and reduced my appetite. It's your choice to use FG or not. I use science to guide my decision, not personal observations. Good luck. 


Insulin levels, hunger, and food intake: an example of feedback loops in body weight regulation

A quote from the study:
"experiments show that elevations in insulin produce increased hunger, heightened perceived pleasantness of sweet taste, and increased food intake"
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3894001/


Effect of Trigonella foenum-graecum (fenugreek) seeds on glycaemic control and insulin resistance in type 2 diabetes mellitus: a double blind placebo controlled study

Abstract

Objectives: To evaluate the effects of Trigonella foenum-graecum (fenugreek) seeds on glycemic control and insulin resistance, determined by HOMA model, in mild to moderate type 2 diabetes mellitus we performed a double blind placebo controlled study.

Methods: Twenty five newly diagnosed patients with type 2 diabetes (fasting glucose < 200 mg/dl) were randomly divided into two groups. Group I (n=12) received 1 gm/day hydroalcoholic extract of fenugreek seeds and Group II (n=13) received usual care (dietary control, exercise) and placebo capsules for two months.

Results: At baseline both the groups were similar in anthropometric and clinical variables. Oral glucose tolerance test, lipid levels, fasting C-peptide, glycosylated haemoglobin, and HOMA-model insulin resistance were also similar at baseline. In group 1 as compared to group 2 at the end of two months, fasting blood glucose (148.3 +/- 44.1 to 119.9 +/- 25 vs. 137.5 +/- 41.1 to 113.0 +/- 36.0) and two hour postglucose blood glucose (210.6 +/- 79.0 to 181.1 +/- 69 vs. 219.9 +/- 41.0 to 241.6 +/- 43) were not different. But area under curve (AUC) of blood glucose (2375 +/- 574 vs 27597 +/- 274) as well as insulin (2492 +/- 2536 vs. 5631 +/- 2428) was significantly lower (p < 0.001). HOMA model derived insulin resistance showed a decrease in percent beta-cell secretion in group 1 as compared to group 2 (86.3 +/- 32 vs. 70.1 +/- 52) and increase in percent insulin sensitivity (112.9 +/- 67 vs 92.2 +/- 57) (p < 0.05). Serum triglycerides decreased and HDL cholesterol increased significantly in group 1 as compared to group 2 (p < 0.05).

Conclusions: Adjunct use of fenugreek seeds improves glycemic control and decreases insulin resistance in mild type-2 diabetic patients. There is also a favourable effect on hypertriglyceridemia.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11868855/