[chichioppai]

I hope I'm not annoying anybody on here with my threads and posts, it might be repetitive but I do want some feedback on what I'm doing right now to have the most effective while being affordable program. Basically, I'm a very overweight person who's trying to gradually lose weight right now but I'm also doing NBE (with hopes of also gaining some fat in the butt and hips through my program). Right now I have fairly big boobs, but I think my weight(mainly stomach), height and broad shoulders don't make them that noticeable on my body. 

My measurements right now:
128 cm(50.4 in.) bust
105 cm(41.3 in.) underbust

I'm not too sure if that's 100% accurate because I measured myself. I think I look like around a 42D and I want to be at least a F cup, ideally H-I cup. I thought I grew a bit in the chest but now I'm not sure because I didn't measure myself before starting NBE and I don't see much of a difference in my breast size. I also want to build a routine that really helps with developing my butt and hips, especially in the fat department, though muscle growth is good too (though that comes more from exercise and protein intake). 

Anyways I ordered some herbal supplements a month ago for my NBE journey and I just want to share what I've been doing and what I can do to improve my routine for better results. I'm not looking for anything rapid and maybe I'm just getting impatient but I do want something that's effective. 

Around August 14th - 20th, I started doing this daily routine for a week to a week and half: 

- 1000 mg of Pueraria Mirifica from Carlyle Nutritional (in 1 capsule)
- 900 mg of Saw Palmetto from Spring Valley (2 capsules/450 mg each)
- 430 mg of Red Clover from Amazing Nutrition : Amazing Formulas (1 capsule)
- 530 mg of Full Spectrum Dong Quai from Swanson (1 capsule)
- 610 mg of Fenugreek from Spring Valley (1 capsule)



Then I decided to reduce the amount of herbs I was taking after reading you only need one herb, 2 or 3 max, for NBE. Basically beginning of September to now:

- Same amount of PM as above 
- 1 tsp (5 g) of Anthony's Goods Red Maca Root Powder 
- 1 tsp (5 g) of Earthly Choice of Maca Powder (presumably yellow) 

I haven't changed much since then except this week beginning on Sunday, I decided to re-incorporate the Saw Palmetto into my routine but only taking 900 mg every 3 days. So today was my second day of Saw Palmetto and I do the PM and Maca daily. I also want to start drinking Spearmint Tea everyday for its antiandrogen properties. I've been drinking Moroccan Mint Green Tea from Trader Joe's and Ashwagandha Chamomile which both contain some spearmint tea, but I'm looking to get straight Spearmint Tea too. 

Is this program enough to see results? Would my recent additions, Saw Palmetto and teas, make a difference in my routine? Do I need to watch out for estrogen dominance and incorporate some PC and/or reduce my PM for better results? My period is due but I haven't gotten it yet, nor the premenstrual cramps, except one time on Sunday. How long do people need to wait until they start seeing results? Every program is different but when should people be starting to see results in general and when should they decide to stop and/or switch their program? 

[black eyed susan]

I'm sure you're not annoying anyone, so I wouldn't be concerned over that. But it's hard to answer many of your questions though, because everyone's different and everyone's hormonal profile is different, so it's not possible to really say how long it's likely to take you to see results.

One thing I can say though is that the Saw Palmetto you're taking isn't likely to make any difference to your progress, as 900mg every 3 days is a very small amount. It's hard to see such a small quantity being useful to you.

Regarding what you say about PC and PM, I don't think you should consider any changes in respect of those things until after your period comes. If it's late you need to see how late it is exactly before you change anything.

[VickyA]

Yes don't make any changes right now. Wait for your period to arrive and if it still hasn't arrived 2 weeks after it's due you should consider temporarily halting your program until it does.

[chichioppai]

Yes don't make any changes right now. Wait for your period to arrive and if it still hasn't arrived 2 weeks after it's due you should consider temporarily halting your program until it does.

I got my period the same day I posted this. I think it got pushed back only by a couple of days or so.

[chichioppai]

I talked to surferjoe2007 on reddit and I've modified my program based on his suggestions. I plan on making further tweaks then sticking to it for 3-5 months to see if I get any results. 

Current Routine(started this week, really last Friday I think):

• 1000 MG of Pueraria Mirifica (1 capsule) 
  
• 1 tbsp of Mixed Maca (1.5 tsp or 7.5 g each of Red and Yellow Maca) 
  
• 2700 mg of Saw Palmetto - whole herb (6 capsules, 450 mg each) 
  
• 6000 mg of MSM (6 capsules, 1000 mg each) 
  
• 10000 mg of Fish Oil (3000 mg of Omega-3 Fatty Acids, 10 soft gel capsules) 
  
• 1 tbsp of Chia Seeds 
  
• 2 tbsp of Flax Seeds 
  
• 2 cups of Green Tea
  

Rub Sesame Oil on breasts and butt and massage it into skin for at least 15 minutes after showering nightly. 

Near Future Routine: 

• 1500 MG of Pueraria Mirifica (2-3 caspules) 
  

• 1.5 tsp - 1 tbsp (7.5 - 10 g) of Red Maca Root Powder
  
• (optional) 1.5 tsp(7.5 g) of Yellow Maca 
  
• 320 mg of Saw Palmetto extract (1 capsule) 
  
• (optional) 1,500 mg of freeze dried aloe vera
  
• 5 g of creatine 
  
• 1 scoop of protein powder 
  
• 1 scoop of collagen
  
• 2,000 mg of HMB capsules 
  
• 2, 400 mg of 50% saponin shatavari extract 
  
• 6000 mg of MSM (6 capsules, 1000 mg each) 
  
• High Strength Fish Oil Capsules  (At least 3000 mg of Omega-3 Fatty Acids, 3 soft gel capsules) 
  
• Mini Pill (progestin birth control) for Progesterone 
  
• 2 cups of Spearmint Tea
  
• 2 cups of Green Tea 
  
• 1 tbsp of Chia Seeds 
  
• 2 tbsp of Flax Seeds 
  
• Surferjoe2007's Nutritional Mix twice daily 
  

Use Fish Oil, Flax Seed Oil or a Combo of Fish/Flax/Sesame Oil on Breasts, Butts and Hips for growth, massage into skin and do massages every night for 15 minutes. This is if Sesame Oil alone doesn't prove to be effective after 6 weeks of use. Trying 75/25 Fish and Flax Oil mix surgerjoe suggested sounds good.

[chichioppai]

I guess this next entry is more of like a diary entry for me.

That other people can read. 

Excited for my BC to come next week. I feel like getting progesterone is going to be the key to getting major results! It's been over a month since I started and people say it takes at least 3-4 months to start seeing results in a lot of programs, but so far I've been seeing minimal results.

 My cleavage looks a bit deeper and there's more dimension to it, and sometimes my boobs were feeling sore, especially two weeks into it, but they don't seem that much bigger than before. I feel like I gained a bit of weight during those first two weeks too, that might be the actual explanation to my boob growth. 

I was hoping for more growth sooner since I'm taking 1000 mg of PM, but I think once I start taking my BC (Lyleq) and the Shatavari Extarct I ordered, I'm going to start to see results faster. But I actually don't mind slower growth because I don't really want more stretch marks on my boobs. I also hope it helps my ass grow but if my nbe routine doesn't do much in that department, I'll just rely on protein, creatine and glute workouts. 

I need to lose weight too because I'm at a really unhealthy weight, heaviest I've ever been, and I think losing a lot of belly fat will help me gain more shape to my body than growing my glutes. It's healthier to lose weight in the torse anyways. I've started walking around for a minimum of 30 minutes, but mostly an hour per day, and doing glute activation exercises by Justin Agustin. I was really inactive and sedentary for over a year, so I want to just get into the habit of walking around for a certain amount of time per day before starting regular workouts, especially muscle building for the glutes. 

If my weight loss cuts down on my nbe progress, that's OK, I want to prioritize that over this but once I lose around 50-60 lbs, maybe I'll focus on maintain the weight I reach and doing nbe and glute growth to get my more ideal shape. So far I haven't really lost any weight yet from doing the walking, I think I need to focus more on my diet which is mostly good but could use more fruits, veggies and lean protein. Im doing good on water and fiber intake though.

[chichioppai]

Another diary entry, so the BC came in and I took my first pill yesterday. It's only been a day, so it's stupid to expect results or changes immediately. I could have sworn my breasts felt a little sore later in the night (Im going to take my Lyleq at 7 pm every evening, my sleep schedule is messed up but I'm probably always going to be awake then). 

Really hoping this will give me some major results because like I said in my previous post, the PM is strangely disappointing. Maybe it's because of my weight, but even doing 1000 mg of PM every day has minimal effects on my boobs so far. People do say it takes up to 4 months to start to see an effect so that might be it, although many people have reported getting bigger in the matter of 1-2 months, even just a few weeks in. 

I want to modify my diet for weight loss and building a more hourglass figure, and maybe even try intermittent fasting for a while. I also want to bump up my exercise routine and work on building up my fitness level because just walking and doing basic glute activation exercises isn't cutting it anymore. 

I know the BC I'm on can cause weight gain which is the last thing I need, so doing something a little more intensive might help me at least maintain my weight until my body gets used to the BC. I'm really out of shape and was super sedentary before starting my current walking routine so thats why I went with that first rather than doing a more standard workout. 

I want to do full body workouts, with a special focus on legs and glutes. I also want to do core, back and arms, so basically the whole body, but I really want to focus on building up my glutes and keeping my mass in my legs and glutes so that it doesn't go away with my belly and back fat. 

I actually don't mind having some back fat, more of the sexiest thick women have it, but I want to shrink my waist and make my rolls smaller. Weird thing to want but my end goal is something that a lot of people would consider overweight, but I want to be attractively thick. I don't know if I can build a more hourglass and pear body with a fat ass and wider hips, but I want to try my best.

Also took 1500 mg of freeze dried aloe vera today, so my daily routine involves both the BC and aloe vera now. I think after I get the shatavari extract I ordered, the new PM and bump my dosage into 1500 mg, and start using the creatine and HMB, I'll start seeing some major changes on my body. I want to use protein powder and collagen too, with the modified diet.

[Jem Jee]

the PM is strangely disappointing. Maybe it's because of my weight, but even doing 1000 mg of PM every day has minimal effects on my boobs so far.

After you finish this PM perhaps you should try a different brand? It seems that the effects of PM can vary significantly from one brand to another.

[chichioppai]

the PM is strangely disappointing. Maybe it's because of my weight, but even doing 1000 mg of PM every day has minimal effects on my boobs so far.

After you finish this PM perhaps you should try a different brand? It seems that the effects of PM can vary significantly from one brand to another.

Already bought Aiternol which got shipped yesterday. From today on, I'm taking 1500 mg of PM, 1000 of the Carlyle PM I was already taking and 500 mg of Aiternol. After I finish the Carlyle, I'll try 1000 mg of Aiternol and see how my body reacts to it. 1500 mg might seem like too much but surferjoe2007 said it should be ok.

[chichioppai]

So, i just went to the doctors office to get a hormones and nutrition test yesterday.They drew my blood and I had to give a urine sample too. I took a break from my birth control for about 2 weeks and took a break from my entire routine/program for this week so the tests reflected my natural baseline hormones and nutrients. 

I'm still worried that the hormones test might come back as inaccurate because I did start my cycle using Lyleq and I got recommended to wait a whole cycle before doing the test, and I think I waited half a cycle instead. 

I'll just have to see if it's accurate or not when I get the results. I also lost about 8 pounds maybe, but I'm coming short of meeting my November 1st goal. It's OK, i just need to stick to a high protein diet and get back on daily walking and my exercise routine, then I'll be able to reach my goals. I do want to get under a certain weight/BMI, then I dont want to worry that much about my weight. 

I think I'll try to measure my progress in terms of appearance and feel of my body and measurements once I reach a point where I'm more comfortable with my weight and waist circumference. And I do want to be more fit and take good care of myself physically, I want to be more energized, fit and prevent potential future illnesses and health conditions as I can. 

Ultimately I want do want a 0.7 waist ratio, right now it's 0.8. But a good in between goal would be 0.75. I could do like 0.775 in a month, 0.75 in three, 0.725 in five and 0.7 by next July. 

Anyways, this is the routine I'm going to do starting tomorrow: 

• 1000 MG of Pueraria Mirifica (1 caspule) (Might bump this up to 1500 mg if I don't see much results in a month. 
  
• 1.5 tsps (10 g) of Red Maca Root Powder, will keep this amount for now. Thinking I might bump it to 15 g after three months if I don't see the desired effects with glute training 
  
• 2700 mg of Saw Palmetto capsules (whole herbs, 6 capsules), 320 mg of Saw Palmetto extract (1 capsule) once the whole herbs run out 
  
• 1,500 mg of freeze dried aloe vera (1/2 tsp) 
  
• 5 g of creatine 
  
• 2,000 mg of HMB capsules 
  
• 1,500 - 3000 mg of 40% saponin shatavari extract (3/4 tsp - 1 1/2 tsp or 1/2 tbsp) 
  
• 6000 mg of MSM (6 capsules, 1000 mg each) 
  
• 1 tablet of Lyleq (0.35 mg) 
  
• 2 cups of Spearmint Tea
  
• 2 cups of Green Tea 
  
• 1 tbsp of Chia Seeds 
  
• 2 tbsp of Flax Seeds 
  
• 2 cans of Sardines for protein and 3,400 mg of Omega-3 Fatty Acids
  

What I want to add: 

• 1 scoop of protein powder 
  
• 1 scoop of collagen
  
• Surferjoe2007's Nutritional Mix twice daily (rice bran, sprililuna, Brewers yeast mix, with juice blended)
  
• 3 Seeds blend (Almonds, pumpkin seeds, sunflower seeds)
  
• More high protein foods 
  
• High collagen foods, like bone broth 
  

 
Use Fish Oil, Flax Seed Oil or a Combo of Fish/Flax/Sesame Oil on Breasts, Butts and Hips for growth, massage into skin and do massages every night for 15 minutes. This is if Sesame Oil alone doesn't prove to be effective after 6 weeks of use. Trying 75/25 Fish and Flax Oil mix surgerjoe suggested sounds good.

I'm going to try to stick to this plan for long as possible. Probably at least a year or so. Might eventually replace shatavari with Fenugreek, but im not sure. 

Will measure myself soon, I don't expect any changes right now, but it's good to document the process.