[BarbieGrrrl]

also what herbs can be taken with pm because some info says one thing then another says different

[Isabelle]

Hi BarbieGrrrl,

Here is my list:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=8419&pid=35038#pid35038

Susan and I have been working on a longer list of phyto-estrogens. The latest version is here:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=8419&pid=41140#pid41140

[transgender newbie]

i am wondering if u can put the list of herb and what they do, top of the thread.

thank you

[Isabelle]

Hi transgender newbie,

It's more convenient to organize the list the other way round, like in the first post I linked above, because it becomes more compact, and easier to memorize. There are four basic NBE functions that everybody here learns fast:

Phyto-estrogens and the body's own estrogens grow the milk ducts, and push the nipples outward, causing the growth you can measure with the tape.

Phyto-progestins and the body's own progesterone grow the milk glands and the alveolas, rounding the breasts out.

Anti-androgens block the production of dihydrotestosterone (DHT) from testosterone. Only muscle growth reacts to the androgen signal via testosterone directly. All other androgen effects are caused by DHT: male pattern baldness, high libido, facial and body hair, oily skin and acne, and the ability to cope with stress. Because the anterior pituitary gland keeps the total amount of sex steroids constant, people take an anti-androgen, to decrease DHT, so there is more room for estrogens. Trying to decrease testosterone itself is counter-productive, because estrogens are made from testosterone.

Prolactin is the hormone that starts milk production, so it causes swelling. Permanent swelling becomes growth, because stretched tissue grows.

The bold face functions are headers in the list I linked in my above post. Under each header, you can find a list of herbs and supplements that perform the function.

If you really need the list organized by herb, you can easily compile it yourself from the above. I'll list a few popular herbs as an example:

Pueraria Mirifica: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen.
Hops: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen.
Fenugreek: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin.
Wild Yam: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin, anti-androgen, and slows the metabolism of estrone, one of the body's own estrogens.
Goat's rue: increases prolactin.
Saw palmetto: anti-androgen.
Fennel: phyto-progestin, increases prolactin.
Soy: phyto-estrogen.
Flax seed: phyto-estrogen.
Licorice: phyto-estrogen, phyto-progestin, anti-androgen, increases prolactin.
Red Clover: phyto-estrogen, phyto-progestin.

Many programs influence more functions than the four basic NBE functions. This is a fairly complete list:
Hormones: cortisol, insulin, Human Growth Hormone (HGH), DeHydroEpiAndrosterone (DHEA), and the three estrogens (estradiol, estrone, estriol)
Growth factors: Insulin-Like Growth Factor 1 (IGF-1), IGF-2, fibroblast growth factors
Proteins: Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (SHBG), albumin
Amino acids: L-arginine, L-glutamine, L-tyrosine
Enzymes: aromatase, 5α-reductase
Vitamins: B6, B12, folic acid or folates, C, D, E
Minerals: calcium, zinc, iron, MSM, ortho silicic acid, iodine
Fillers: water, collagen, hyaluronic acid, omega-3 fatty acids (flax seed oil), omega-6 fatty acids (borage oil, Evening Primrose Oil, GLA), coconut oil, olive oil, castor oil, gelatine

Now the entries for the herbs become longer, for example:
Hops: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen, increases HGH, decreases IGF-1 at high doses.
Fenugreek: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin, increases insulin, improves insulin sensitivity, increases HGH.
Flax seed: phyto-estrogen, increases SHBG, source of omega-3 fatty acids.
Goat's rue: increases prolactin, improves insulin sensitivity.

Some herbs are used for their effects on other than the main four NBE functions:
Oats: phyto-estrogen, decreases SHBG, source of zinc and iron, source of vitamins B6 and E, amino acids, orthosilicic acid.
Maca: increases DHEA.

In a list like this, the effects of an herb are expressed in terms of the functions, rather than in tangible NBE results. Results are often dependent on a combination of herbs, like the net effect of oats and flax on SHBG, which can cancel each other. Results depend on doses too: zinc helps in growth and swelling above 12 mg. Above 35 mg, it decreases prolactin, and above 80 mg, it becomes an androgen.

[little mandarins]

Wow, thats 2 very informative lists you have there Isabelle, thanx for taking the time to post that, I'm going to try and print them out [/u]

[onicemile]

That post should always stay on top. Up !

[floness2011]

Hi transgender newbie,

It's more convenient to organize the list the other way round, like in the first post I linked above, because it becomes more compact, and easier to memorize. There are four basic NBE functions that everybody here learns fast:

Phyto-estrogens and the body's own estrogens grow the milk ducts, and push the nipples outward, causing the growth you can measure with the tape.

Phyto-progestins and the body's own progesterone grow the milk glands and the alveolas, rounding the breasts out.

Anti-androgens block the production of dihydrotestosterone (DHT) from testosterone. Only muscle growth reacts to the androgen signal via testosterone directly. All other androgen effects are caused by DHT: male pattern baldness, high libido, facial and body hair, oily skin and acne, and the ability to cope with stress. Because the anterior pituitary gland keeps the total amount of sex steroids constant, people take an anti-androgen, to decrease DHT, so there is more room for estrogens. Trying to decrease testosterone itself is counter-productive, because estrogens are made from testosterone.

Prolactin is the hormone that starts milk production, so it causes swelling. Permanent swelling becomes growth, because stretched tissue grows.

The bold face functions are headers in the list I linked in my above post. Under each header, you can find a list of herbs and supplements that perform the function.

If you really need the list organized by herb, you can easily compile it yourself from the above. I'll list a few popular herbs as an example:

Pueraria Mirifica: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen.
Hops: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen.
Fenugreek: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin.
Wild Yam: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin, anti-androgen, and slows the metabolism of estrone, one of the body's own estrogens.
Goat's rue: increases prolactin.
Saw palmetto: anti-androgen.
Fennel: phyto-progestin, increases prolactin.
Soy: phyto-estrogen.
Flax seed: phyto-estrogen.
Licorice: phyto-estrogen, phyto-progestin, anti-androgen, increases prolactin.
Red Clover: phyto-estrogen, phyto-progestin.

Many programs influence more functions than the four basic NBE functions. This is a fairly complete list:
Hormones: cortisol, insulin, Human Growth Hormone (HGH), DeHydroEpiAndrosterone (DHEA), and the three estrogens (estradiol, estrone, estriol)
Growth factors: Insulin-Like Growth Factor 1 (IGF-1), IGF-2, fibroblast growth factors
Proteins: Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (SHBG), albumin
Amino acids: L-arginine, L-glutamine, L-tyrosine
Enzymes: aromatase, 5α-reductase
Vitamins: B6, B12, folic acid or folates, C, D, E
Minerals: calcium, zinc, iron, MSM, ortho silicic acid, iodine
Fillers: water, collagen, hyaluronic acid, omega-3 fatty acids (flax seed oil), omega-6 fatty acids (borage oil, Evening Primrose Oil, GLA), coconut oil, olive oil, castor oil, gelatine

Now the entries for the herbs become longer, for example:
Hops: phyto-estrogen, anti-androgen, increases HGH, decreases IGF-1 at high doses.
Fenugreek: increases progesterone (controversial) and prolactin, increases insulin, improves insulin sensitivity, increases HGH.
Flax seed: phyto-estrogen, increases SHBG, source of omega-3 fatty acids.
Goat's rue: increases prolactin, improves insulin sensitivity.

Some herbs are used for their effects on other than the main four NBE functions:
Oats: phyto-estrogen, decreases SHBG, source of zinc and iron, source of vitamins B6 and E, amino acids, orthosilicic acid.
Maca: increases DHEA.

In a list like this, the effects of an herb are expressed in terms of the functions, rather than in tangible NBE results. Results are often dependent on a combination of herbs, like the net effect of oats and flax on SHBG, which can cancel each other. Results depend on doses too: zinc helps in growth and swelling above 12 mg. Above 35 mg, it decreases prolactin, and above 80 mg, it becomes an androgen.