[Mellephant]

Hello Kittiekat,

That's a real hard one as everyone is on slightly different programmes and it all works differently for everyone.

The personal programmes page is really useful, and what you will see is that people tweak their programme along the way in response to new knowledge and figuring out how their body responds.

The herbs you have chosen sound good although I would suggest adding Red Clover, quite a few are having good restults with Fenugreek and red clover. See Doll's programme I don't think she cycles but takes a few days off per month. I found her programme page very helpful and inspiring and she's had great growth.

If you decide to go for PM you will prob need to cycle it, and don't use other phytoestrogens as they will compete for your receptors and cancel each other out. Red clover is a phytoestrogen.

Take lots of measurements before u start, from here to here and here and here! I only let myself measure once a week, or I think I'll be too obsessed, lol.

Good luck, I think with your age and that you've had a child you have great chances of success.

Keep us updated x



I've got no idea about wild yam. I have a pot indoors and I can't remember what I read that made me want to buy it,

[Etna1407]

If you decide to go for PM you will prob need to cycle it, and don't use other phytoestrogens as they will compete for your receptors and cancel each other out. Red clover is a phytoestrogen.

I did not know this! if this is a hard fact it would explain why i haven't heard of anyone taking PM on top of an herbal regimen.

I have been on a fenugreek, wild yam, red clover and saw palmetto regimen for over a month and seen some small improvement. I ordered a bottle of Nature's answer PM to ramp up my regimen after my monthly cleanse. I planned on taking just one pill on top of my regimen for the first 14 days of my cycle and skipping it the last 14 days.

I always wondered why most programs make it seem like it has to be one or the other, and why noone has tried simply doing both. It seems like so many have gotten great results from PM, so I've been wanting to try it but i'm afraid of losing growth if i stop my herbal regimen (which seems to be working but its really too soon to tell).

if what you say is true, should I take PM for the first 2 weeks of my cycle with no other herbs, and switch it for my regular herbal regimen in the later 2 weeks?

lol sorry about all the questions, this information just threw a major kink in my plan and i'm wondering if i should switch and take the risk or just forego the PM for my regular routine.

[tatiana673]

how is the japanese PM any different from the regular one? (ainterol and siriporn an thanyaporn?)

[Mellephant]

Hello Etna,

Hmmmm that is a tough one.

In short yes I think that's what some people do, take pm for first part of cycle then herbs for second part, although the question would be whether to still use the Red Clover or not ?

I'd say def dont use it at the same time as PM, but wonder if anyone can comment using it on, say, days 19-24 meaning your receptors have a 4 day break either side? It may be safer to leave out Red Clover altogether if u do use pm. Maybe give your current programme a bit longer if it seems to be going well, though.

I'm in a similar situation, I was on PM but not cycling as I'm on progesterone injection and therefore have no cycle. Was doing pm for 2 & a half months had an inch of growth but then nothing (I'm really impatient tho )

I've just switched to a similar programme to yours and am wondering whether to still use the pm at all.

My thinking at the moment is to stick with this programme for the time being as I feel even though it's only been a couple of weeks, I feel like somethings happening, I seem to have gained half an inch in a week or so, BUT I dont know if this is due to the new herbal programme OR the effect of switching from pm - like mixing it up a bit - which does beg the question should I switch between the two????

Any ideas are welcome

What differences have you noticed since being on your programme?

It's so exciting when something is happening isn't it?

[mochaccino]

Mellephant, you tried PM along with a progestin based PC but you didn't grow? That's very interesting. I've been trying to figure out why some people get spectacular results from it and others get nothing. I have a sneaking suspicion that the type of progestin used might be the key. The progestins used in BC are sometimes very odd. Many of them dont act much like progesterone at all. Some are progesterone agonists while others are antagonists. There are even some that behave more like estradiol, and they can have varying effects on lots of other hormones as well. I find it all very confusing. Exactly what was the name of the birth control you were using? Do you know what kind of progestin it contained? I wish more people would try a basic PM + BC program so we could build up a list of which BC types work alongside PM, and which don't. Of course it might have something to do with individual hormone balance as well. Ive been thinking about trying nuvaring with PM after I run out of herbs, if cycling doesn't work. The only results Ive seen this cycle are slightly leaky boobs

[Mellephant]

Hi Moccacino,

Well I grew an inch, but I don't think anyone would notice, my man hasn't, lol.

Have been wondering the same, that maybe where I thought I had enough Progesterone because of the depo-provera injection, I'm thinking of adding wild yam.

I have no cycle, I'm thinking of taking herbs as tho I do have a cycle, and as it's the first on Saturday, a good time to start, will be easy to remember what day of cycle I'm on, lol.

Going to have a 4 day break starting tomorrow but really torn as to then continue FG, red clover SP, then add wild yam days 15-30....

OR pm days 5-12 break for 4 days then FG, RC, SP & WY days 16-30.

What do you think?

(I also take MSM, collagen, ginko biloba, vits c & b, iron calcium zinc & l-Arginine

Been massaging with flax seed oil.

[mochaccino]

Thanks Mel!
After I look up which progestin is used in the depo shot, I hope I can figure out what class of progestins it belongs too, or at least what it's basic hormonal effects are. I just remembered that MydreamisGcup was on depo, so now I'm really confused. She grew extremely well.

Did your growth come all at once and then stop, or was it spread out over the entire 2 1/2 months? Im just trying to figure out whether you stalled completely or just had slow steady growth. To be honest, 1 inch growth in 2 1/2 months is not that slow at all, but it's a different story if you shot up an inch in a week and then got nothing for the remainder of the time.

[AbiDrew85]

Depo shots should contain medroxyprogesterone acetate. It's a synthetic progestin that is believed to be many times stronger in its effect than real progesterone. Unfortunately, it also has many really bad side effects unrelated to its activity on progesterone receptors.

Honestly, if you're not on it already, I would never recommend it, and if you are, I'd suggest you consult your doctor about alternatives. It's technically considered "safe", but there are strong links between its use and breast and skin cancers.

I dunno about you... but I wouldn't be terribly eager to run the risk of cancer unnecessarily.

[Mellephant]

Hello Moccacino

Yes I'd read mydreamisG's threads before starting so I thought I'd find it easy.

I've looked in my diary, I started PM 8th May, I'd grown half an inch by the 19th May. Grew another half inch by July 1st.

I did a week's milk thistle cleanse qt the end of July and kept my inch.

In august I continued pm until 18th Aug, still at 1inch gain.

Started Fenugreek and Red Clover on 20th Aug and on 25th Aug had gained an extra half inch.

Strange thing this afternoon, I've had some spotting. I've not had ANY menses since I went on injection in Dec 2010.

I've checked I'm not pregnant.

Gonna break off everything till the 5th Sept I think.

[Squirrel with boobs]

how is the japanese PM any different from the regular one? (ainterol and siriporn an thanyaporn?)

just the name itself makes it better... it has "porn" in it.. (giggle) so it must be good!