(This post was last modified: 30-09-2012, 02:57 by TibetanPrincess.)
(30-09-2012, 02:44)mochaccino Wrote: Apparently there's been only ever been one identified case of true estrogen insensitivity, and the article I read implies that the results of true estrogen insensitivity would be very severe and noticeable. I wonder if instead our bodies are just massively over compensating for the excess estrogen by pumping out loads of SHBG, or maybe down regulation is occuring at an unusually fast rate, or some other compensating mechanism I could never even think of. Of course, none of those other explains are necessary if it turns out that we do just have low E. Besides, lled and I are not the only women who have ever had a very muted response to PM. I wish I could remember their usernames. If low E is not the cause, than it really is a big mystery.
Mocha,
Good thing you have brought this up as this is on my mind often.
The strange thing is, I had low hormones after this growth spurt from PC and other herbs I had been taking and PM was one of them. It was the last one I tried and as a matter of fact, it did absolutely nothing for me in the three months I had taken it but it stopped my period.
I think I heard somewhere that if you take enough phyto estrogens, you can hault your own output of real hormones and these hormones are stronger right, so can you imagine when we stop these, we have low to no hormone output and we are losing our growth because of it. I think this may have possibly been the case with me as my MD was scratching his head as to why I had such overall extremely low hormone output for my age.
The last time I did any tests granted, was years before but I was regular and I had not spotted like I did when I came off the herbs this last time around. Two months later after the trial of PM, I became irregular and my boobs lost half of what I gained. But I was also on a extreme healthy diet with no meat for 21 days, who knows but this does make nothing but sense.
That's also a very good possibility... Increased SHBG, whatever it's cause, could explain all sorts of problems.
And various other ways in which our hormones mess about with each other in ever widening circles of loopbacking.
IF she in fact IS low on hormones, then there's definitely some SHBG or some loopback signals getting messed with.
Be careful with the definition of "true" estrogen insensitivity. It's just like with androgen insensitivity, there's full and there's various levels of partial effecting various ranges and classes of receptors. Yes. "True" estrogen insensitivity has had very very very precious few reported actual cases... This would be the full sort. And would have dire and immediately recognizable consequences.
But partial? In men a partial that only effects the beta class of estrogen receptors would go completely unnoticed. The beta class only exists in feminine tissues. In females? It could still take an awful long time before being noticed especially if it also only effected a very small range... say... in the breast tissue only.
Breast-tissue centric, Beta-class only, partial estrogen insensitivity would lead to a severely decreased growth rate in the breasts and a complete lack of receptivity towards PM and many other phytoestrogens which seem to bind more readily to the beta receptors than the alpha receptors.
So... what all that scientific mumbo-jumbo boils down to? It's still possible, that a very limited form of partial estrogen insensitivity, COULD be effecting lled. Nothing is certain, and she'd have to have the theory checked by an endo, but it is POSSIBLE. Even if she did have it checked, there's nothing that can be done for it.
What she's essentially doing with the noogling is increasing her number of receptors, and if the beta receptors are non-receptive, then she needs a LOT more receptors for the alpha's to pick up the slack.
It perhaps would have been even better if she had been noogling while in early puberty with the massive flood of hormones during that time.
i'm aware that it's very possible that i have unresponsive estrogen receptors in my breasts. PM does have an affect on my libido, so i know i'm not altogether desensitize to estrogen. i'm hoping brava will/is/has been creating new breast tissues glands giving more estrogen receptor sites... but this is all guess work.
i've been sick. had a yeast infection, followed by a cold. my breasts have definitely taken a toll even though i spent lots of time wearing brava in bed. my swelling hasn't been as large as it was before i got sick. i think i might be slowing down or stalling, but hopefully not shrinking. i don't think i've made any progress in the past month.
it seems to be the norm to have growth spurts and stalling periods. i wonder why this is. it might be time to switch things up a bit. i'm thinking of taking PM all the way through the month since i don't want to get pregnant at this point - higher dosage the first 3 weeks, then the remainder of the time, lower PM dosage with PC cream.
also, i haven't been consistent with my GR tea recently. i wonder if that's why my breasts hasn't been as full. but i don't want to be taking GR for the rest of my life in order to stay full.
on the bra sizing front, i'm at the point now where none of my bras fit me right. 34 band is too large for my 27.25" rib cage. 32a bras make my boobs look too close together. 32b fits ok on the rib cage and doesn't make my boobs too close together, but the cups are a bit too large. so now i'm thinking of trying on a few different 30c bras.
my original goal was to get to a full 34a. but since my band size has gone down, my goal now is to be 32b.
OK I get what the last posts suggest for lled. Here's a new problem to think about. Lled & I could be twins in our struggle in NBE except that I am a 62 yr old menopausal female. I never knew about NBE until 2010 when I found this forum by accident (I was looking into implants at the time). So am I doomed in my quest? I tried BO, Greenbush, PM & now Eve M's program to no avail. I did NG for about a year w/o success either. If there is hope for me, what should I try next?
Thanks
(Sorry lled about your latest bump in the road. Chin up - you'll bounce back).
(09-10-2012, 01:34)lostacres6 Wrote: OK I get what the last posts suggest for lled. Here's a new problem to think about. Lled & I could be twins in our struggle in NBE except that I am a 62 yr old menopausal female. I never knew about NBE until 2010 when I found this forum by accident (I was looking into implants at the time). So am I doomed in my quest? I tried BO, Greenbush, PM & now Eve M's program to no avail. I did NG for about a year w/o success either. If there is hope for me, what should I try next?
Thanks
(Sorry lled about your latest bump in the road. Chin up - you'll bounce back).
Lostacres, you can't really compare your self to someone who is quite younger. You two may have different underlying causes and need a completely different approach. The question is, "what is your cause?" and "What nbe method is suitable for your unique needs.
I am no doctor, but I suggested you get an extensive panel done and maybe look into hrt. Have you even attempted? I have a feeling you need a lot more than lled does. You should really find out instead of poking around nbe protocols that aren't going to deliver.
thanks Abidrew and lostacres. more would be great, and i'm trying to keep my chin up, but it's hard. my patience and wearing thin.
brava update:
i've completed 30 weeks of brava, and am now starting my 31st week. there was a point when i thought i would probably quit after 30 weeks. but, i'm looking at where i'm at now and i'm not happy with my size.
last month, i averaged 13hrs a day. the past week and a half, i only averaged 11hrs of wear a day. i think this explains why i've been looking smaller than usual at night. i'm really bummed because i was hoping i'd be larger by this point.
i'm seeing a new guy and he likes breasts, large breasts. i'm barely a handful on a good night at the right angle. i'm growing impatient and frustrated.
lled,
BELIEVE me, I know your frustrations but WOW, looking at your before & after, you've made tremendous progress. Keep in mind, comparing ourselves, you have 30 more years of growing while I have barely 5 (if I'm lucky).
I'm going to look into hormone testing & see if it will help me pinpoint better what I'm lacking.
By the way, the GR helps me swell alot even if it's not permanent. Maybe you can up you dose of GR - at least to make youself feel better while you're growing. Just a thought.
Best regards.
thanks lostacres, and good luck with the hormones testing route. GR doesn't seem to have much effect on me anymore. i think my body has gotten used to it. i think i'm going to take a break from GR for now and resume next month maybe.
i just received suplife PM 99 in the mail. i'm trying yet ANOTHER PM brand. it seems as though i hit a plateau with siriporn and st herb so maybe this will help. i plan on taking 3 suplife PM 99 a day, morning, afternoon, and night.
i've been slacking on brava hours so my swelling hasn't been as great, and they don't linger as long as they used to. i have a new 32b bra that i can't quite fill out. this will be my goal bra.
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