[muzhiben]

You can't really tell when you ovulated without doing BBT or an ovulation test, unless you're one of those women who can actually feel it happening. Most women who have a long cycle tend to have a normal length follicular phase, but I'm sure it varies from person to person, and maybe even within one individual if they're actively messing with their hormones.

That's interesting moka, for those who can "feel" their ovulation. no i didn't feel anything for that, just according to the period tracker app i have on my phone, it showed me that day was 2 days before ovulation, so i don't know for sure.

but what i can feel is that my flatties started to pain slightly as usual in about 3 days after i collect the sample, i believe that's when my high points start, which i'll try collect the sample during one of those swelling days, should give me an better idea how high i naturally get.

i'm getting the kelp and dandelion today, need to flush the cortisol. papaya working good so far, shortened my digestive time and did good cleansing as well. i'm retaking the calcium and multi vitamins now, i'll skip the collagen since protein intake works better than pills.

i've got some concerns regarding pm, i read an article saying pm plant is nearly no longer available in the wild of thailand, so are these pm supplements made from cultivated plants then?

[AbiDrew85]

besides estrogen and progesterone.
there are other hormones needed for breast growth, HGH, prolactin, adrenaline, Insulin, thyroxin, FSH, LH, Adrenocortical hormone.
Drew, should i boost all of those? or how do i check if i'm lacking them?

Let's just concentrate on the primary ones for now... I'm one of those people who prefer to concentrate on just one thing at a time.

36 day irregular period... that's a little more difficult to track, as mocha said... Have you always had a long and irregular period?

[AbiDrew85]

i've got some concerns regarding pm, i read an article saying pm plant is nearly no longer available in the wild of thailand, so are these pm supplements made from cultivated plants then?

Yes. But you actually want cultivated. Cultivated plants means that we have a pretty good idea how concentrated the miroestrols are.

[muzhiben]

36 day irregular period... that's a little more difficult to track, as mocha said... Have you always had a long and irregular period?

From 09/2010-10/2012, these are my cycle length:
33 29 33 29 26 40 29 31 31 29 29 30 44 39 27 31 36 28 32 28 31 35 43 30

i now haven shortened cycles, used to have my period every two months when i was in my early twenties, due to malnutrition, i had a harder life then, now it's slightly better.

it's quite difficult for me to eat, since i don't enjoy doing it, low carb diet is probably not for me, since i need carbs for they are easier to break down and go into my system and build tissues, protein is harder, and i can't digest them without the help of papaya.

eating more and sleeping well is what i'm trying to accomplish as well, haven't been able to get some good rem sleep since my brain just won't rest.

libido helped me gained weight before, something to do with the hormones raise that were associated with it.

as for my cycle, each time about a week half before my period, my chests get tender, i think that's the raising hormone sign, i could use this to collect my next sample maybe?

Yes. But you actually want cultivated. Cultivated plants means that we have a pretty good idea how concentrated the miroestrols are.

great, now i have to pick a better brand of pc with true natural wild yam and a good pm when i can get to start.

[AbiDrew85]

great, now i have to pick a better brand of pc with true natural wild yam and a good pm when i can get to start.

Uhm. You really don't need it to have wild yam in it. It won't make a difference either way. Usually USP progesterone as used in progesterone creams are made from diosgenin extracted from wild yam, but the diosgenin could be extracted from just about any source really.

The important thing is the amount of USP Progesterone per yadda yadda. 500mg is the desired concentration.

[muzhiben]

great, now i have to pick a better brand of pc with true natural wild yam and a good pm when i can get to start.

Uhm. You really don't need it to have wild yam in it. It won't make a difference either way. Usually USP progesterone as used in progesterone creams are made from diosgenin extracted from wild yam, but the diosgenin could be extracted from just about any source really.

The important thing is the amount of USP Progesterone per yadda yadda. 500mg is the desired concentration.

i see, i'll take the source naturals pc on amazon then, seem to be 500mg per ounce.

A bit frustrated these days since i'm currently suffering from autumn depressive disorder. feeling myself being tossed in-between hope and despair is devastating, but if i don't go through this, well i just have to go through this, might be my last chance.

[Helena St]

You should really take a look at this thread to get a clearer idea of why it's not a good idea to take more PC than you need: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=13320

Use the PC carefully and test your progesterone levels every 3 months to make sure that your progesterone levels haven't become excessive. It would be even better to test all your hormones every 3 months, but I know how expensive that is. Dr. Lee's site sells progesterone tests for only $35 but I don't know where you live or if you'll be able to buy from that site: http://www.johnleemd.com/store/prod_stest.html

Thank you mochaccino!

That progesterone only test is so affordable!

I've stopped PC already listening to the doc i've talked to, she said it will be cleaned out of my system eventually after couple cycles.

Another reason i stop is to see if the growth i experienced is for real or just swelling.

And i don't agree to Dr.Wong's idea of estrogen being useless in breast growth, well his wife already have milk ducts fully grown of course she'd only need pc to build fat only. but for us who has no breast tissue or fat, we actually need both like what Isabelle explained.

Plus i bet part of my growth is linked to my breast sensor responding to estrogen as well, since pc activated them.

I remember reading one of drew's post somewhere, stating it is best to keep estrone estradiol and progesterone at high point but below tolerance level, at this point my progesterone is sky high and estrone and estradiol is only a quarter of the normal high range.

So, what are your suggestions to raise a bit more estrone and estradiol? soy maybe?

I am a little confused on progesterone storing fat. I'm still learning about this so anyone correct me if I have this wrong.

From what I understand, I though it was estrogen that encouraged fat storage by upregulating A2 receptors in female pattern fat cells - breast hips thighs. Activating A2 receptors tell the cell not to release fat. Estrogen can actually help with fat loss in other ways - http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/losefatnow4.htm

Now the progesterone itself can store in the fat cell, which would make them larger, but not by adding more actual"fat" to them right?
I believe progesterone actually stimulates lipogenesis (release of fat).
It also causes swelling (which I DEFINATLY got during pregnancy) If you have high estrogen and progesterone, like in pregnangy you will get fat storage, swelling/gland growth and probably some growth from progesterone storage in the breasts.
Then when you have the baby and quit breastfeeding, the progesterone gets all used up, boom you deflate. I experienced this also. It took a while for them to go down, I was still breastfeeding till 14 months and by then even they were a little bit smaller after loosing pregnancy weight, and then once I weaned, they shrunk a little more, I guess from no more milk and losing that last few lbs. Now they are just back to where they were before pregnancy, but a little saggier from the streched skin and tendons.

Sooo anyhow, I can see how progesterone could work on someone with underdeveloped glandular tissue and cause growth there, and also temporarily plump up your fat cells, but it may not help with a more permanent fat storage which is what gives you more cup size in the end. (not that any fat storage is totally permanent depending on diet)

I am pretty sure I was fully developed when I got preggo - 34C. If I had been a 34A with some fat there, but underdevelped glands, then I can see how the extra progesterone during pregnancy might have brought me to a more permanent 34C afterwards. Right now I'm working on focusing on getting back some fat storage there through the use of topicals.

[mochaccino]

This is not NBE related, but if you're interested, I could email you an ebook called The Mood Cure. I should warn you that I do not agree with every last thing in that book and the author has a few dangerously quackish ideas, particularly in the sections about thyroid and sex hormones. She is not an endocroligist and quite frankly does not know what she's talking about when she veers outside of her specialty. Im actually considering sending you only the sections on serotonin and dopamine as well as the recommended supplement list and diet recommendations. The rest of that book could get you in serious trouble. I know that doesn't sound like a ringing endorsement of the book, but all it really means is that a psychiaytrist should not attempt to do the attempt to do the job of an endocronologist. I actually really like the book and I would recommend it more freely if it werent for the few kooky parts. PM me if you are interested.