[AbiDrew85]

By dark circles do you mean around your eyes? My eyes ALWAYS have dark circles too!

dark circles around the eyes= iron deficiency!

Yep. But I'm taking 130mg of supplemental iron a day. Why isn't it being of more benefit? I'm seriously thinking it might be circulation. I get cold easy, especially in my fingers, my veins are really large, I'm tired all the time unless I'm like SUPER active. I can not be relaxed or I will fall asleep. The circles and the tiredness is iron deficiency, yes, but the other stuff indicates poor circulation. My iron deficiency may not be a problem of intake or even necessarily uptake, but of delivery.

EDIT:

After doing some additional research on the subject in general and on Horse Chestnut in particular as well as various other herbs used for circulatory problems, I feel Butcher's Broom is going to be closer to fulfilling my needs. If not, I can always buy Horse Chestnut instead later. But I'm going to give Butcher's Broom a 2 month attempt first.

Thanks for even popping the idea into my head at all Doll! I was really at a serious loss as to why I should STILL be experiencing iron deficiency symptoms while taking such a large dose of iron!

[TibetanPrincess]

By dark circles do you mean around your eyes? My eyes ALWAYS have dark circles too!

dark circles around the eyes= iron deficiency!

Yep. But I'm taking 130mg of supplemental iron a day. Why isn't it being of more benefit? I'm seriously thinking it might be circulation. I get cold easy, especially in my fingers, my veins are really large, I'm tired all the time unless I'm like SUPER active. I can not be relaxed or I will fall asleep. The circles and the tiredness is iron deficiency, yes, but the other stuff indicates poor circulation. My iron deficiency may not be a problem of intake or even necessarily uptake, but of delivery.

EDIT:

After doing some additional research on the subject in general and on Horse Chestnut in particular as well as various other herbs used for circulatory problems, I feel Butcher's Broom is going to be closer to fulfilling my needs. If not, I can always buy Horse Chestnut instead later. But I'm going to give Butcher's Broom a 2 month attempt first.

Thanks for even popping the idea into my head at all Doll! I was really at a serious loss as to why I should STILL be experiencing iron deficiency symptoms while taking such a large dose of iron!

I've got this same problem too! I have read about it and but nothing as far as results. I would love to see a before and after if you have one. I have that stupid vein underneath my eyes! with circles no darkness per se but those stupid raccoon circles!

[AbiDrew85]

I've got this same problem too! I have read about it and but nothing as far as results. I would love to see a before and after if you have one. I have that stupid vein underneath my eyes! with circles no darkness per se but those stupid raccoon circles!

Yeah. I haven't seen any actual evidence of results out of anyone either, just reviews and medicos saying that Butcher's Broom works best for general circulation problems while Horse Chestnut is more for "venotonic effect, vascular protection, anti-inflammatory and free radical scavenging properties" and "chronic venous insufficiency" possibly as a result of "post-thrombotic syndrome".

The lattermost certainly is something that many of us might need to concern ourselves about - estrogen supplementation is very strongly linked with deep-vein thrombosis, which is the event that can trigger the long lasting damage of a post-thrombotic syndrome.

I really don't think I have had a deep-vein thrombosis though I could be on my way if I don't do something to help my circulation NOW.

Anyways. Maybe I'll start a new thread in one of the Other sections about this problem and try to include close-ups of my eyes and hands, where IMO, the bigger-than-normal veins are their most obvious. I won't do whole-body shots for my program until I feel better about my looks, but I think I can handle doing this much.

[mochaccino]

Abi, are you open to using something topical for your under eye circles? Vitamin K and chrysin are supposed to work very well in combination. There's a woman from a skin care forum who goes by the name "Fawnie", and she REALLY knows what she's talking about. She started her own small skincare line and she sells a lightening serum with Vitamin K and chrysin that's supposed to be very nice. It's a little expensive but I think it should last about 3 or 4 months at least. http://www.myfawnie.bigcartel.com/produc...-eye-serum

[AbiDrew85]

Abi, are you open to using something topical for your under eye circles? Vitamin K and chrysin are supposed to work very well in combination. There's a woman from a skin care forum who goes by the name "Fawnie", and she REALLY knows what she's talking about. She started her own small skincare line and she sells a lightening serum with Vitamin K and chrysin that's supposed to be very nice. It's a little expensive but I think it should last about 3 or 4 months at least. http://www.myfawnie.bigcartel.com/produc...-eye-serum

While I'm not adverse to using topicals, I am adverse to the idea of treating symptoms instead of seeking and treating the causes.

IF my eye circles AREN'T connected to the apparent circulation problems, THEN I will certainly consider a topical treatment just for them, since at that point I will have exhausted any possible explanations for underlying causes and just have to accept that for whatever reason I will forever have dark circles under my eyes that I'll have to treat topically for the rest of my life.

EDIT: Well, unless someone else comes along with some other thing that might possibly be causing it. LOL.

[Babakins]

OMG Don't buy from Fawnie! Her products are scams, she does not disclose proper ingredients, has no real license to trade. One person tried an item and had a very bad reaction.

She was the person who got thrown off Skin Care Talk and banned for life for recreating fake PMs and causing all manner of trouble. She also sent a few dodgy items to members on the forum as freebies then turned very nasty when they did not buy from her.

Just be very careful and test out anything with a lab that you get from her. I was tempted but thankfully did not succumb.

[Babakins]

I get dark circles and have a few veins in the under eye area. The best thing I have used to date and there are lots. Is the NIA24 under eye cream. It has really thickened the skin and lightened the area. It takes AAAAGES but I have seen the results are good. Plus niacinamide is excellent for the strengthening and lightening of redness.

[AbiDrew85]

OMG Don't buy from Fawnie! Her products are scams, she does not disclose proper ingredients, has no real license to trade. One person tried an item and had a very bad reaction.

She was the person who got thrown off Skin Care Talk and banned for life for recreating fake PMs and causing all manner of trouble. She also sent a few dodgy items to members on the forum as freebies then turned very nasty when they did not buy from her.

Just be very careful and test out anything with a lab that you get from her. I was tempted but thankfully did not succumb.

Haha. I don't know anything about her or whatever. But IF I go down the topicals road at some point, I'll do my own research and eventually settle on something most likely from either Amazon or Swanson's. The latter is an herbalist I trust and the former carries just about everything these days, but I'd do a LOT more product research than what I even subject stuff at Swanson's to, which is still a lot more than most people would a company they claim to trust lol.

I didn't put "Resident Science Geek" as my tagline for nothing!

[Babakins]

^^^^ Good Girl Abi!

[mochaccino]

Babakins, Thank you for warning me, although I'm not so sure that everything is what it seems. Skincaretalk exists to promote certain companies that they are paid to promote, and they are NOT transparent about it at all. I'm well aware that Fawnie was banned from the forum at one point, but so was every other seller that was not paying to advertise their product on SCT. SCT later came begging on their hands and knees for these sellers to return after it became clear that SCT was not getting as much traffic without them. Most, if not all of them, did rejoin the forum. As far as I can tell, the original banning had nothing to do with "protecting" members, which is why SCT had no problem with allowing them to come back. Maybe Fawnie was an exception who really deserved it, but I think you can see why I can't just trust that SCT banned her for good reasons.

I don't really mind that she doesn't have a license to trade (assuming that's still the case), but of course I do mind if her products don't contain what she says they contain. I wonder who said that her products contain ingredients that are not disclosed? How do they know? Did they actually pay to have it tested in a lab? Of course, I have lots of other questions too. What "fake" PMs? What nastiness? I really do wanna know, and I will be PMing you for details if that's ok. We already totally hijacked Dolls thread and it's all my fault. I'm glad you brought this up, because it's probably about time I looked into it more deeply. I admit I'm biased in favor of Fawnie, but only because I don't trust SCT further than I can spit.

So sorry for the hijacking Doll I'm going away now