[nsas]

I've always had symptoms of excess androgen, but lately I'm experiencing symptoms of estrogen deficiency mainly night sweats. I'm too young for menopause and I fear if I continue chiyomilk's program I might go into perimenopause. Has anyone with estrogen deficiency and excess androgen done well on this program? Does this mean the only program for me is based on PM sorely? Since I'm on the pill, can I take PM everyday with perhaps a lower dose during the luteal phase? Can I still continue taking placenta c jelly? Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

[timarie]

I've always had symptoms of excess androgen, but lately I'm experiencing symptoms of estrogen deficiency mainly night sweats. I'm too young for menopause and I fear if I continue chiyomilk's program I might go into perimenopause. Has anyone with estrogen deficiency and excess androgen done well on this program? Does this mean the only program for me is based on PM sorely? Since I'm on the pill, can I take PM everyday with perhaps a lower dose during the luteal phase? Can I still continue taking placenta c jelly? Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

Hi nsas!

I'm sorry as I am not the best candidate to answering your question, but my situation is sort-of related to yours.

I have normal estrogen levels, but I am testosterone dominant, and the Chiyomilk program did not work for me (I was on it for 6 months and only experienced about a cup size of growth in the first month when I was starting with pig placenta before taking any pueraria mirifica). As I understand it, being dominant in testosterone increases the "traffic" of hormones (basically, being dominant in anything, really ), and my increasing of E through PM without decreasing my testosterone effectively (I was taking SP which is actually not recommended for women who do not have PCOS and is over-utilized on this forum) just contributed to the traffic of hormones even more, which disabled my P and E hormones from attaching to their receptors, and hence what swelling/temporary growth I had in the first month from the pig placenta diminished. It was a lot of estrogen for me (even though I was taking relatively small doses of PM [330mg] for 9 days out of my cycle), considering that I had normal estrogen levels coupled with high testosterone. You, however, COULD possibly benefit from an increase in E in moderate doses BUT you would need to effectively decrease your T for any of it to benefit you! Are you taking anything to decrease your T?

As for you being on the pill, you really have no need to cycle as far as I am aware Take a look at Bonita's PM program. You can take PM every day, with a consistent amount throughout. But, in answering your question if the only program for you is based on PM solely: certainly not (although PM IS a great option for you, given that you decrease your T)! BO also raises Estrogen levels as well, and as mentioned above, JUST increasing your Estrogen levels will not help you that much unless you lower your T, so PM solely is actually not a great idea. As for placenta C Jelly, it is a form of glandular therapy which should theoretically encourage your ovaries to increase Progesterone, but not Testosterone or Estrogen (I think I am quoting Tibetan correctly here...). It should be certainly safe for you, as far as I am aware. I am now taking BO which as you know is another form of glandular therapy, except the only difference is that BO is stronger (since it is the actual ovary instead of the placenta), and it also encouraged the ovaries to increase the production of Estrogen and Testosterone. I am taking Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint to decrease my Testosterone. I have been on BO for 2.5 weeks and the antiandrogens for only the past few days and my boobs are sensitive and paining and feeling dense and heavy! Even though it IS at the very end of my cycle at the moment, I never have sensations like this EVER (except for the very beginning of my Chiyomilk program as I mentioned above), so I do have a good feeling about this!

But, either way, considering that you have a history of having excess estrogen and now are deficient in it (according to your symptoms), it may be very beneficial to you at this time to get your hormone levels tested, so that you may: 1) confirm or prove wrong your assumption of your E levels and T levels 2) see what your other hormone levels are so that you can see how they all come into play for your situation, and 3) know what your needs are and what you should take.

I have no idea if I answered your question at all, but I hope my rambling helped a little in some way

[maaryy]

Hi timarie!


I'm now starting my PM program! I'm thinking of taking something to reduce my testosterone level. I believe it's not too high! I have little facial hair.
when I was younger, I had PCOS. but today, I have no more. I don't know if it's common to disappear, but It's been normal ovaries for about 4 years from now!

So is saw palmetto not appropriate for me? what you are taking as anti-androgen? It has a good effect to balance the estrogen increase of pueraria mirifica?

mary

[nsas]

I've always had symptoms of excess androgen, but lately I'm experiencing symptoms of estrogen deficiency mainly night sweats. I'm too young for menopause and I fear if I continue chiyomilk's program I might go into perimenopause. Has anyone with estrogen deficiency and excess androgen done well on this program? Does this mean the only program for me is based on PM sorely? Since I'm on the pill, can I take PM everyday with perhaps a lower dose during the luteal phase? Can I still continue taking placenta c jelly? Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

Hi nsas!

I'm sorry as I am not the best candidate to answering your question, but my situation is sort-of related to yours.

I have normal estrogen levels, but I am testosterone dominant, and the Chiyomilk program did not work for me (I was on it for 6 months and only experienced about a cup size of growth in the first month when I was starting with pig placenta before taking any pueraria mirifica). As I understand it, being dominant in testosterone increases the "traffic" of hormones (basically, being dominant in anything, really ), and my increasing of E through PM without decreasing my testosterone effectively (I was taking SP which is actually not recommended for women who do not have PCOS and is over-utilized on this forum) just contributed to the traffic of hormones even more, which disabled my P and E hormones from attaching to their receptors, and hence what swelling/temporary growth I had in the first month from the pig placenta diminished. It was a lot of estrogen for me (even though I was taking relatively small doses of PM [330mg] for 9 days out of my cycle), considering that I had normal estrogen levels coupled with high testosterone. You, however, COULD possibly benefit from an increase in E in moderate doses BUT you would need to effectively decrease your T for any of it to benefit you! Are you taking anything to decrease your T?

As for you being on the pill, you really have no need to cycle as far as I am aware Take a look at Bonita's PM program. You can take PM every day, with a consistent amount throughout. But, in answering your question if the only program for you is based on PM solely: certainly not (although PM IS a great option for you, given that you decrease your T)! BO also raises Estrogen levels as well, and as mentioned above, JUST increasing your Estrogen levels will not help you that much unless you lower your T, so PM solely is actually not a great idea. As for placenta C Jelly, it is a form of glandular therapy which should theoretically encourage your ovaries to increase Progesterone, but not Testosterone or Estrogen (I think I am quoting Tibetan correctly here...). It should be certainly safe for you, as far as I am aware. I am now taking BO which as you know is another form of glandular therapy, except the only difference is that BO is stronger (since it is the actual ovary instead of the placenta), and it also encouraged the ovaries to increase the production of Estrogen and Testosterone. I am taking Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint to decrease my Testosterone. I have been on BO for 2.5 weeks and the antiandrogens for only the past few days and my boobs are sensitive and paining and feeling dense and heavy! Even though it IS at the very end of my cycle at the moment, I never have sensations like this EVER (except for the very beginning of my Chiyomilk program as I mentioned above), so I do have a good feeling about this!

But, either way, considering that you have a history of having excess estrogen and now are deficient in it (according to your symptoms), it may be very beneficial to you at this time to get your hormone levels tested, so that you may: 1) confirm or prove wrong your assumption of your E levels and T levels 2) see what your other hormone levels are so that you can see how they all come into play for your situation, and 3) know what your needs are and what you should take.

I have no idea if I answered your question at all, but I hope my rambling helped a little in some way

Thank you so much for extensively explaining everything. As of last night, I stopped the Greenbush pills and extract. I did have my hormones checked before a year ago and everything was normal. I just know that I have excess androgen or am really sensitive to them. I think the components of the Greenbush products, which are intended to increase progesterone, led to the imbalance. I should start my next cycle next week. Do you think I should take something to cleanse my system or lay off of everything for a week should do the trick? Bonita, I believe was on a Progesterone only bc, so she responded well to PM. I chose PM over BO bc people were responding well and at a faster rate to PM, but now knowing that you felt a difference in less than a month makes me want to try it out. Or should I give PM without cycling another shot?

[timarie]

Thank you so much for extensively explaining everything. As of last night, I stopped the Greenbush pills and extract. I did have my hormones checked before a year ago and everything was normal. I just know that I have excess androgen or am really sensitive to them. I think the components of the Greenbush products, which are intended to increase progesterone, led to the imbalance. I should start my next cycle next week. Do you think I should take something to cleanse my system or lay off of everything for a week should do the trick? Bonita, I believe was on a Progesterone only bc, so she responded well to PM. I chose PM over BO bc people were responding well and at a faster rate to PM, but now knowing that you felt a difference in less than a month makes me want to try it out. Or should I give PM without cycling another shot?

Oh yeah, so I really am only familiar with the progesterone-based BC. What kind of BC pill are you on? And for how long have you been on the Chiyomilk program? How many miligrams of the Greenbush products were you taking a day (the recommended dose, and it was the enhancement blend, correct?). This may be some news to you, but... none of the herbs in Greenbush's enhancement blend raise progesterone! So I do not know why they would advertise that it is intended to increase progesterone I think maybe a week of Milk Thistle should do the trick, as far as cleansing goes, but that will not be enough time to get your hormones back to where they were before you started your program (which I assume is what you want). The PM capsules I would take at the beginning of my cycle would effect the onset and cramping intensity of my following cycle, so the estrogen remains in the system for at least a good month.

[timarie]

Hi timarie!


I'm now starting my PM program! I'm thinking of taking something to reduce my testosterone level. I believe it's not too high! I have little facial hair.
when I was younger, I had PCOS. but today, I have no more. I don't know if it's common to disappear, but It's been normal ovaries for about 4 years from now!

So is saw palmetto not appropriate for me? what you are taking as anti-androgen? It has a good effect to balance the estrogen increase of pueraria mirifica?

mary

Hey Mary!

I personally do not know a whole lot about PCOS. BUUUT I can recommend you to two great antiandrogens! I am taking Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint. If you look at post #92 on my bust thread (the one I recommended you see in your Fenugreek question thread ), Abi explains the difference between Saw Palmetto and Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint, if that will help you with making your decision! And, you can always ask Abi herself

And the antiandrogens don't "balance the estrogen increase" but I assume you mean that they will be good enough to bring your testosterone down enough to help with your body's utilization of the new phytoestrogen hormones brought in from PM? If so, then yes, it should be, as far as I know.

And congrats on being PCOS free for the past 4 years! That is great.

[maaryy]

Thanks for the reply timarie !
I'll get more information about the skullcap! I´m interested!
About spearmint, I use essential oil of peppermint in my massage oil. A drop that oil equals 24 cups of tea. In 100 ml of almond oil (normal) I mix 16 drops of peppermint essential oil. I think my skin is absorbing it well! But I feel safer swallowing something! lol that's why I will look for this tea.

About PCOS and I really do not know what really happened , but I have a hunch . I know I took BACH essences and various other floral systems (from Brazil, australia, eua, europe) . ( A proper U.S. is California Flower Essences) . Picked essences of the feminine aspect for a while . They seek the balance of negative traits in the personality of the individual . Always admired a woman's ability to be generous and welcoming . In my opinion, this is the nature of women . Give birth to a baby and love him . believe that the profound nature of the woman disappeared ! His animal aspect to prolong and protect life disappeared or it´s disappearing !

Anyway , I took some beautiful flower essences about feminine aspect! After that , suddenly, my period was regularized and some female characteristics just welled up in me! Of course that the use must be continuous ! to internalize the new features! And that takes time (more than a few months) !
After taking several essences for several traits , my life has improved a lot ! NEVER had a headache ( maybe 2 or 3 times ) . Increased my immunity. Had about 3 or 4 colds ! This in years! My PCOS disappeared ! My self -esteem has increased ! Anyway , several things happened !

I know it´s a total different matter from initial topic! But when it comes to this conversation, I love talking about flower essences! I did so well! I recommend you all try! It´s not good paying $100 for a consultationt with a floral therapist ! The flowers should be investigate by yourself and you must analyze yourself deeply!

Hi timarie!


I'm now starting my PM program! I'm thinking of taking something to reduce my testosterone level. I believe it's not too high! I have little facial hair.
when I was younger, I had PCOS. but today, I have no more. I don't know if it's common to disappear, but It's been normal ovaries for about 4 years from now!

So is saw palmetto not appropriate for me? what you are taking as anti-androgen? It has a good effect to balance the estrogen increase of pueraria mirifica?

mary

Hey Mary!

I personally do not know a whole lot about PCOS. BUUUT I can recommend you to two great antiandrogens! I am taking Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint. If you look at post #92 on my bust thread (the one I recommended you see in your Fenugreek question thread ), Abi explains the difference between Saw Palmetto and Chinese Skullcap and Spearmint, if that will help you with making your decision! And, you can always ask Abi herself

And the antiandrogens don't "balance the estrogen increase" but I assume you mean that they will be good enough to bring your testosterone down enough to help with your body's utilization of the new phytoestrogen hormones brought in from PM? If so, then yes, it should be, as far as I know.

And congrats on being PCOS free for the past 4 years! That is great.