[CousinRose]

Ok, so we all know we shouldn't take weaker phytoestrogens with PM so they don't compete for the recipient sites. What I don't understand is why people take fenugreek with red clover and see results from it but it is not ok to use fenugreek with PM. Both Red clover and PM are stronger phytoestrogens then fenugreek so I am a little confused. Any input would be highly appreciated.

[surferjoe2007]

Phytoestrogens in RC are both weak and very abundant so they flood receptors and block others. It's even in some supplements meant to combat excess estrogen even with as little as 400 mg RC.

I don't think FG is really a phytoestrogen. It indirectly has some estrogen-like effects in women, but mainly because it amplifies existing effects. Thus it combines very well both with RC and, yes, PM. But taking RC and PM together would not be good.

FG can also be used to promote progesterone, prolactin, insulin or even testosterone in men. Whatever you already have.

[Babakins]

can red clover be used topically for example the extract in a serum for massage, if using PM?

[CousinRose]

Thanks SurferJoe =) So maybe I should try taking PM and FG together. I need to increase my estrogen and red clover would not be the best option I guess. I might try one month and see how it goes.

[carolanlorraine]

Thank you all for this info. Cousin Rose how did it work taking RC in follicular phase? I'd love to hear your progress. I intend to massage RC in during follicular but could that compete them with PM-as it's still absorbed into the body?

Thanks Ladies,

[GeriTopaz]

Wait I'm confused, I was told FG was the best for this...now it's not?

[SirenofTitan]

I have a question of my own...is it okay to take PM in the luteal phase and red clover in the follicular phase or is it best to avoid putting those two in the same program?