[mochaccino]

How come I never noticed this before? I had been wondering why St Herb PM seems to have a better record of success around here, compared to other PM brands. I didn't think it was very likely that their PM works better because it's "stronger", if only because I have a theory that PM is often already too strong for people with very small busts, but I couldn't think of anything else that could make their product different from the other brands available. If their product really is a special blend that would explain a lot. Here is a snippet from the description of their capsules:
"Pueraria Mirifica Capsules is female dietary supplement that contains Pueraria Mirifica Extract which is rich in estrogen-like compounds called phytoestrogens. These compounds formulated with various natural herbal extracts will increase phytoestrogens as well as promote nutritional support in female body."

And here is a blend available at their bulk site:
http://www.puerariamirifica.com/pueraria...powder.htm

A snippet from the description of the powder blend:
"This type is for manufacturer who wishes to use our formulation for their production."

Am I understanding this correctly or coming up with crazy theories ? I'll have to try to get in contact with them. Has anyone already asked about the ingredients of their capsules?

From my point of view, the question is this, If their capsules really are a blend, does their formula work better because it actually contains less PM than other brands since it's not pure PM? (keeping in mind that I think the recommended doses of most brands might be too high for most small busted women) Or is it because the blend really is "special"? If it turns out their caps really are pure PM I'll feel a little stupid
So confusing!

[mochaccino]

This is a "translation" of all those latin names in the mixed powder. Notice it says it's only 60% PM. Then again they recommend that you take 4 caps a day, which is 800 mg, not much less than what other brands typically recommend. But do people usually take that amount? I think somewhere else on their site they recommend starting at as little as 400 mg per day, with a maximum of 1000 mg. Apparently each pill contains 200 mg PM, not the typical 500 mg.

Ingredients :
Pueraria mirifica Herbal --- 60%
Ginger --- 10%
Safflower --- 10%
javanese long pepper (I've never even heard of this this before) ----10%
Bukkum wood (huh??) --- 10%

This is an ingredient list in milligrams, from a different site:
Ingredients: Pueraria Mirifica (root or tuber) 200 mg
Zingiber officinalis Roscoe (root or rhizome) 17 mg
Piper chaba Hunt (stem) 17 mg
Caesalpinia sappan linn (stem) 16 mg

But how is 200 mg 60% of 250 mg? Are the percentage based on something other than weight, or is the second list wrong?

[lled34aa]

thanks for looking into this, but i think it's all a shot in the dark. St. Herb is in Thailand. there isn't any sort of regulations or rules that they have to adhere to regarding truthfulness and correctness in their description and ingredients list. not to mention, the english translation on their site is a little off anyways. i wouldn't take their description word for word, to heart.

i take 4 St Herb PM a day with no side effect that i am aware of. sometimes i sneak in a 5th one in the middle of the day to see what happens - no difference. i am getting slow gradual growth ever since starting St Herb pills and cream.

i don't know if i agree with the theory about PM being too strong for women with small busts. i am extremely small. i've tried herbs only, BO, weaker PM, all with no success. right now i'm pretty much piling on the PM pills, cream, serum, and herbs... attacking this from all angles so to speak, and my boobs are finally starting to respond. so i think it all comes down to individual experimentations.

[mochaccino]

But do you cycle it? I was wondering if cycling bypasses the potential stalling issue by giving receptors a rest. Then again you might have some special problem with insensitivity to estrogen.

[Pansy-Mae]

But do you cycle it? I was wondering if cycling bypasses the potential stalling issue by giving receptors a rest. Then again you might have some special problem with insensitivity to estrogen.

I agree with lled that I wouldn't take a Thai translation as being gospel truth.
I agree with you on the cycling theory you've outlined, I think exactly the same, myself.
However I don't really understand your 'too strong' idea? I suppose it may possibly be different for women, but PM works for males who start with zero boobs, so I don't see how it can be too strong if you have a little something already to build on and get you going?

Pansy Mae

[mochaccino]

I don't know what to make of male responses when it comes to hormonal forms of BE. Guys must have much, much fewer receptors than women, and yet they almost always require a whole lot more phytoestrogens. I'm guessing male bodies have a very different way of dealing with excess estrogens. I have no idea at this point if PM contains a much higher concentration of phytoestrogens then other herbs or not. Obviously my idea rests on the assumption that it does. It could be that certain phytoestrogens trigger down regulation more easily than others, but I don't know nearly enough abou the human body to say if that's even possible. I suppose relative binding affinity might play a role. There are so many questions when it comes to PM, because it acts so differently from other phytoestrogenic herbs. It's not enoug for me to just know that it's different. I gotta know why, lol :p

[Pansy-Mae]

.... It's not enoug for me to just know that it's different. I gotta know why, lol :p

Well, without a couple of degrees in biochemistry, endocrinology, etc, you are probably never going to know 'why?'... or 'how?'.
The only thing that matters is 'does it?', to which the answer is 'yes', and from there, 'how much?', to which the answer is, "Everyone is different, you need to experiment to find the right level for you, and that will probably change over time anyway".

Pansy Mae

[lled34aa]

what do you mean by "cycling it"? like take it for half a month and off for the rest of my menstrual cycle?

[mochaccino]

Yea, that's what I meant. Thanks